From Flu Wiki 2

Forum: I Cannot Believe This Article

05 August 2006

Not_Again – at 00:50

What has the world come to?

Parents to sue government over bird flu scare

Apriadi Gunawan, The Jakarta Post, Medan

The parents of three young children from North Sumatra’s Karo regency who were earlier reported as exhibiting classic bird flu symptoms plan to sue the provincial administration and the central government for saying their children most likely had bird flu.

The plan was disclosed Friday when the parents along with the director of the Legal Aid Institute for Health met Karo Regency Legislative Council members.

Institute director Iskandar Sitorus said the lawsuit, which is being prepared and is expected to be completed in three weeks, would target Health Minister Siti Fadilah Supari and President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono. The lawsuit will be filed at Central Jakarta District Court.

…… more to read by clicking on the link

http://tinyurl.com/jmhap

glo – at 00:56

I don’t know what to think~

heddiecalifornia – at 00:58
  Hmmmm — maybe a world after bird flu won’t have any lawyers in it? 
Not_Again – at 01:03

It’s not the lawyers, it’s really the people who say I’m gonna sue! that are mucking up our country. Supply and demand kind of thing. Anyway, now do you think especially in the USA that they will say John Doe has bird flu? This makes it harder and worse for everybody.

Leo7 – at 01:23

Maybe they thought the health minister and others in the group used their children for a photo op. Remember the villagers made them take off the gear and got angry over the culling of their preps (chickens are their preps). I suspect the villagers have little respect for the govt.

Oremus – at 01:34

heddiecalifornia – at 00:58

They say cock roaches will survive a nuclear war.

Ima-Prepper – at 03:15

Ditto to Leo & Not again. My sentiments as exactly.

Foolish people sue those who serve to protect them to the point they risk their own well being and those who have their well being in mind. In the end everuone suffers.

Reader – at 03:17

Did they ever pass the legislation here in the US where we can’t sue the big pharma companies who make the vaccines? Most likely it will be expanded to include being quarantined and reporters who cover the news about it. I can see the government protecting itself in all aspects of this.

What would you do if someone, for revenge or fear or kicks or whatever, told the government that you have bird flu and you just have the regular ol’ flu, but now your life is in shambles because you can’t work, no one will come near you, etc.? On the one hand the government has to quarantine you, how would they know for sure until the testing is done. On the other hand, your life is turned upside down (and probably inside out).

Ooooh, I sure hope I’m not one of the first in the US to get bird flu! Just think of the press on that one. Pass the Nyquil please, and bring me another gallon of it! :>)

Ima-Prepper – at 03:33

Reader:

There needs to be some valid proof/lead other than heresay and yelling fire in a crowded theater.

If I was quarentined personally and denied proper medical treatment and assessment I would have a beef with it then. Otherwise I ere on the side of caution even if it is an inconvenience. And understand that even in the best intention to err is human.

Ima-Prepper – at 03:35

Otherwise I ere on the side of caution even if it is an inconvenience.

Especially if I were in a high suspect area.

Ima-Prepper – at 03:39

I have also read articles (unfortunaly I have not bookmarked them) that many in the most poorest regions do not belief that Avian flu even exhists and that it is a way the government controls them. Avian is conspiracy that does not exhist. How do you reach those people to tell them it does?

Ima-Prepper – at 04:05

Not_Again – at 01:03 It’s not the lawyers, it’s really the people who say I’m gonna sue! that are mucking up our country. Supply and demand kind of thing. Anyway, now do you think especially in the USA that they will say John Doe has bird flu? This makes it harder and worse for everybody.

Agreed. If John Doe actually did have it and wasnt quarentined because of political correctness and you got it from him, 20 years from not you still would be dead while John do might have been lucky to survive and talk about the inconvenience to his grandkids.

Reader – at 04:28

Ima-Prepper,

There will not be any validity or proof until after the quarantine and testing. People can very easily be ripped apart in the news. I had some neighbors once who the ex-wife accused the ex-husband of molesting their child. He proved it wasn’t true, but before it was over, the whole town was accusing him (actually it was gossip) of molesting children all over, some he had never met. I’m just saying accusations are easy to make, but they can destroy a life.

As for a conspiracy, a lot of people believe that. They will not be reached. They will be the first to cry fowl (sorry for the pun) when TSHTF.

Ima-Prepper – at 04:55

Where health is concerned annominity is crucial whether in quarentine or not.

Reader – at 05:13

Everybody, I hesitate to make fun of any group of people. Lawyers are the front line of defense in this country for protecting our rights. Even the lowest life scum deserves to have someone on their side in a court. That’s basic, written into the Bill of Rights. And we also have a redress of grievence. That doesn’t mean that we will win if we sue, it means only that we have the right to try. The family above probably won’t win their case, but luckily their government sees the value in and the right of their attempt.

No, I’m not an attorney, but I did stay at a Hooligan Inn last night. :>)

Reader – at 05:16

Oh my goodness, look at the time! Nite nite.

handle – at 06:56

heddiecalifornia – at 00:58

Yeah the radioactive lawyers will probably survive. On the bright side, maybe the radiation will cause the lawyers to mutate and grow consciouses.

handle – at 06:58

consciences

Too quick with the trigger finger.

Average Concerned Mom – at 08:11

Hospitals should keep personal infomration private. I would be upset if they names my child’s name along with them being suspected of having a deadly and infectious disease.

I’ve been wondering about how the names of these suspected bird flu patients — and all the details of their lives — gets into the papers so fast. As well as their condition (worsening, fever temperature, test results.) Are the hospitals holding detailed press conferences daily, letting people know intimate details about people’s medical cases?

There could be great stigma for these children now that they are back home — along the lines of being a suspected AIDS patient in the 80s I think.

worrywart – at 09:36

yes-the article says that neighbors were “shunning “ the children. Gotta see it from the parents point of view too.

handle – at 12:56

The children are not going to be traumatized if the neighbor kids aren’t allowed to play with them for a while. So what if they are being shunned for a week or two? They’ll get over it. The neighbors have no reason to be assured whether the children had H5N1 or not. At the rate these test results change, people could have ebola-ized H5N1 and still a test might not confirm it. There is too much that is unknown about the virus. People are just being prudent and cautious.

anon_22 – at 15:05

This bit of news brings up a few things for me:

First of all, I think it reflects the general lack of co-operation of people in the area

When all those who got sick in May died, I wonder what the local people concluded. That this was a dangerous disease? Or that there was a conspiracy to kill people? If there was a widespread denial that bird flu existed in their midst, such that most people actually believe that to be the case, I don’t blame the parents for getting upset at the hospital authorities!

I am reminded of efforts to eradicate Ebola in Africa where, because of the close to 100% death rate, people ran away from ambulances, thinking these were the cause of death. There are places in some underdeveloped countries with low education levels where spirit possession, curses, and evil spells are everyday ‘occurrences’, and beliefs regarding the origins of disease bear no resemblance to ours.

That being the case, any suggestion of being associated with such negative forces could carry a stigma that is hard for outsiders to understand. I have read stories of children in some remote parts of the world being hunted down and killed for being ‘possessed’ and therefore likely to bring misfortune to the whole community.

It is conceivable that those parents are only trying to ensure the safety of their children after they leave hospital.

worrywart – at 16:14

Anon 22 thanks -you said it much better than I. Things are not always what they seem-and we don’t understand all the cultural and social implications of a foreign culture.- best to defer judgement.

anon_22 – at 17:33

This issue has been causing increasing concern in the UK for children of recent immigrants, especially of South Asian or African backgrounds. The following is from a UK government report on Child Abuse Linked to Accusations of “Possession” and “Witchcraft” happening in the UK

‘’‘Seventy-four cases of abuse clearly linked to accusations of “possession” and “witchcraft” were identified.’‘’

“The abuse in question occurs when an attempt is made to “exorcise” the child. The abuse consists of severe beatings and other premeditated cruelties such as starving, burning and isolating the child. The perpetrators are usually carers – often not the natural parents – and the abuse usually occurs in the household where the child lives.”

“There appear to be common features between cases, for instance, a child being scapegoated, family structure and disability.”

cabingirl – at 18:28

I think this could be bad news (If one is trying to watch the comings and goings of H5N1 from afar). Hope I’m wrong, but once this starts, it will likely continue. Lets see how transparent govs are to report “suspected cases”. Me thinks we will start hearing about only “confirmed” dead, and if more privacy issues arise, then could name/age, city/town/ village, etc., also be withheld. Actually governments might relish the idea. Could this open a whole can of worms as far as MSM reporting is concerned? Where would that leave us….no boiling pot to watch? Is it any different legally than protecting those who made have been exposed to TB, HIV, etc., here in our country? hummmmm. Thoughts?

08 October 2006

Closed - Bronco Bill – at 22:11

Closed to maintain Forum speed.

Closed - Bronco Bill – at 22:11

Closed to maintain Forum speed.

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