Wasn’t there another post that mentioned that the Pandemic plan, or some other emergency executive powers, empowered the government to seize food, weapons, property, and personnel in times of emergency. That could be a good reason to keep preps under wraps. Has anyone ever told someone that they are are prepping, the importance of prepping, given suggestions to prep, etc. and now wish they had been a little more ‘discreet’?
I mentioned prepping to my neighbor and now the conversations lean towards what “WE” will do etc. I personally think that neighborhoods and communities will need to work through anything together but it seems like we have entered into an unspoken partnership that may be more one sided than I like. Also, I don’t know who else he or his wife may have told about our conversations. I don’t mind helping but I can’t have anyone other than my family depend on me. Honestly, I don’t have enough set aside for us yet, just a small closet with enough extra groceries to last a few weeks at most.
During Y2K in 1999,,,I taught a class on preparation in my community, was on a local board to get the community get prepared and freely gave information about preparations etc, that I had, so that others would pay attention etc,,,but this time around, have kept every close to my chest, while increasing the preparations. This time I do believe it is much more likely to happen that preps will be needed to get from this side and thru a pandemic to the other side of it. I do have spare to share, for neighbors, family etc, if needed, but they do not even know it.
Gary, I am envious. I wish I was at that state of prepping to feel like I could share. I am a very giving person…when I am not being selfish. :-)
No. I have been a kook for years, and remain so. However I am rightly percieved as a well prepared, well armed kook. Those who prepare to survive deserve to survive. I will continue to spread the word and what people do with it is up to them. Kelly
If one looks at preparations as a ever widening circle, with the bulls eye, or center, being YOURSELF, and slowly expanding the circle outward, then including live in family, then a widening circle, encompassing others (friends first then neighbors), then widening circle yet, for others. As the circle widens, the preps become more expensive, less space to “hide the preps”, more thoughts on what kind, and thinking of possibilities, you can vizulize the system. Begin small with yourself, then expand outward, but do not feel guilty if the outer circle is not completed in clude neighbors and others. The real goal is take care of your own needs and your family needs first and foremost, while keeping the preps secret and always thinking about circumstances if TSHTF,, such as: In case of electricity going out, would you advertize that you are prepped in an area surrounded by others, if you had an electric generator that made noise day and night, giving you lights, and other day to day liveables while other had none. On the other hand, if you had a kerosene latern, that would be normal, and would not draw much attention by others, if the blinds were closed etc.
The thing being that if one is prepped, one must be careful to flaunt the preps in the face of others when those others may not be as prepped. Not talking about something that may last a couple of weeks like a windstorm, etc, but a long term situation. I used to have a complete solar system, that would creat lights all over my property, run my well etc, but now downsizing in that I do not want to advertize how fully prepped I am. I have a solar cooker and will use that before a barbeque, propane burner, or other food odor producing cooking way. I hope this helps some, but if you have question ask away.
When I first started prepping I told a few people that I knew would take it seriously. And it pleases me to say that they too are also prepping. The only advice I can give is be very careful about who you tell… and make sure they are not you next door neighbor. Not only for obvious reasons that they may become a nuesuance during a disaster…as they may think your just plain nuts if they don’t understand fully why your prepping. I told only one neighbor (that I believed would prep). He seemed to understand ..but his wife thinks we are crazies and they don’t talk to us anymore. Hmmm kinda feel like Noah…
When I first became aware of bf and the need to prep(duh I learned of it like 3–4 years ago, just learned of prepping like in Nov 05)I went out to the emergency management meetings talking my little heart out about the need to prepare.I now feel I revieled enough in that I was even thinking about preparing,I worry that the emergency management people and health dept people will think of me and come get my preps.I guess they will be surprised by how little we have.Kids home for summer has really took a bite out of our preps.I don’t talk about it too much anymore.
I have worried about this a lot. I have decided to keep my mouth shut, help my family all I can, I live by myself and have no children and although am on disability I have prepped quite a bit. I know my neighbors well enough to know if anything bad happened they would come down here and take everything I have and expect more. they treat me like a quick trip store now if they need anything. I have been practicing saying the word no and have come to the conclusion that I will tell them no from now on. I hate doing this but there is a difference in helping someone and being taken advantage off, I have asked them for help a time or two with things and they never can do anything so I am no longer mr nice guy up to a certain point. I would never let someone starve to death but I won’t let them make me do without either. so the number one rule to me is keep my mouth shut and prep away.
Each person has to live with their own actions.
I have decided that I will spend a good deal of effort to warn those I care for that I think bad times are coming and that they should prepare for them. I am willing to take the risk to warn those I am close to.
I have also rather bluntly disabused those I have spoken to that seem to assume they now have gotten an invite to show up if TSHTF. I have told them bluntly not to come without a specific invitation. I have also told them that if they DO come without an invite they’ll be leaving, without any support from me.
My friends and family also know that I never bluff. Most of them are prepping to the extent they can afford to. Those that aren’t will have to live with the consequences. Or not.
on the fence, I used to offer free emergency preparedness classes in my store, I could barely get anyone to sign up (save for a short time period after 9/11). There is just no interest in something so mundane as saving your own and your families life… good grief, there is American Idol, soap operas and football games to watch. And I have, in the past, made the mistake of telling certain people the extent of my preps. No more, and I hope that the people I DID tell have forgotten about it by now. I think that Katrina opened my eyes as to what could happen in a disaster. I intend to lay low, help whoever I can without revealing my identity or the source of the help, and hope that those I’ve told about my preps have short memories.
There are a lot of people in my life that I really care about, both family and friends. I have told them about the possibility of a pandemic, and that it would be good if they had a number of weeks of food/water on hand. Most have ignored the suggestion, but a few have purchased some extras. I have told no one the extent of our preps. I figure its up to them to investigate and make up their own minds.
That said, I also feel somewhat uncomfortable with all the people I have talked to about this. Many have children and I fear if it gets bad, they would do anything to get food for them. Yikes.
Warning people is a double-edged sword. I’m pleased some have prepared even somewhat and I feel good about that, yet also scared that those that have not will think of us when their stomachs begin to growl seriously. On one level, I regret warning them, but also know I would do it again.
If this, or anything, gets to any degree of major food shortage… or any other kind of major “lack”… well… it will not be pretty. I can tell you from personal experience it is ugly to be prepared when others are not… a hurricane story. Generally speaking, people start demanding to be taken care of and how unfair “it all is.” Talk turns to ugly action. Never mind warnings or common sense precautionary preparations--- somebody else is suppose to take care of us. Keeping preps a secret will be a cat out of the bag as soon as somebody notices “others” who aren’t wild-eyed, panic stricken, emaciated, screaming for help and demanding (even if it is “my” stuff.) But, maybe I am wrong and we still live in a society that will pull together like they did across the globe during the Great Depression. A time when people didn’t expect others to take care of them and were very thrifty. On the other hand, that was also a “time” of horrific brutality on mankind… and a major war insued.
EnoughAlready at 18:45-Even with the best of us atavistic currents of thought get rolling when we are sleep-deprived, stressed, hungry, cold, or thirsty. You want to lose weight through the First Wave and lie low with the lights down. If you want to contribute, do it anonymously with essential workers connected with keeping the grid going. That is the best target for any altruistic efforts. You can team up with the canny and the prepped, (that you didn’t know about), after the first big shake-out.
Just read on the Yahoo Science newsfeed that mankind will need to produce FIFTY per cent more foodstuffs in TWENTY years to keep everybody fed, (assuming a linear progression, which is doubtful).
Fifty per cent foodstuff with 50 per cent less oilstuff.. Well how are we gonna do that?..Hmm.. Time to find that old chemestry set and start with that good old cold fusion experiments again. ;)
Got my kids Ped. to fork over scripts for my kids for Tamiflu . Had to first talk with her about and then followed up with a letter. She took a couple of weeks to decide whether or not to give me the prescrips and wrote me a letter explaining why she did but wasn’t thrilled about it. For a Dr. I have to say her reasoning was muddled and confused. I think she wrote them only because I had now put my request on record with my letter and she was basically covering her ass just in case. I expect to run into the same logic or lack of it from my own General P. As far as other preps. I’m not talking to anyone about this anymore. I did for a month got the strange looks and stares and just decided to go ahead and start doing it quietly. Nobody prepares for anything anymore. Most people in this country are barely making ends met ,including me but this is a situation that has to be dealt with and talking about it just is a replacement for real actions.
urdar-Norge,
And how did that work out for you?
well I lack one finger after my “simple living “ holliday so it will take some time I guess..
Has anyone asked their supervisor at work if the company has a plan for AI?
urdar-Norge, isn’t your finger healing? I hope you mean that you can’t use it right now because it’s bandaged.
I remowed the stiches today. its so ugly I will use it to scare of anyone comming for my preps :D nahh its fine, I have learned to use the next finger instead, and luckily it was not my right hand. still typing wrong but… :)
On the fence…
In response to your question there is Presidential Executive Order (EO 12919). Google it if you like and read the whole thing… but here is the jist of it below. Personally it gave me “goose bumps”.
Taken from EO 12919: © Be prepared, in the event of a potential threat to the security of the United States, to take actions necessary to ensure the availability of adequate industrial resources and production capability, including services and critical technology for national defense requirements;
(1) The Secretary of Agriculture with respect to food resources, food resource facilities, and the domestic distribution of farm equipment and commercial fertilizer;
(2) The Secretary of Energy with respect to all forms of energy; (3) The Secretary of Health and Human Services with respect to health resources; (4) The Secretary of Transportation with respect to all forms of civil transportation;
(5) The Secretary of Defense with respect to water resources; and
(6) The Secretary of Commerce for all other materials, services, and facilities, including construction materials.
no name – at 21:10
“Has anyone asked their supervisor at work if the company has a plan for AI?”
I wrote the pandemic plan for the small non-profit I work for, and the board approved it. Just waiting for the signs to initiate implementation. Hopefully those signs will never appear, but Indonesia has good me staring at the computer screen a lot.
The Captain – at 23:22
“(5) The Secretary of Defense with respect to water resources”
That caught my attention. Need to go to sleep, but will have to take a closer look at that first.
Okieman,
A lot of us are staring at the computer screen.
From the Presidential Executive Order (EO 12919).
(m) “Water resources” means all usable water, from all
sources, within the jurisdiction of the United States, which
can be managed, controlled, and allocated to meet emergency
requirements.
Is this the operative Presidential Executive Order in the event of an Influenza Pandemic?
Okieman,
I think there remains some confusion as to line of authority during a pandemic, at least in my mind. I think DHS is in charge, but that HHS and CDC will be involved in the medical response, but I’m not sure.
See this Testimony by he Honorable Jeffrey W. Runge, M.D., Acting Under Secretary for Science & Technology and Chief Medical Officer, U.S Department of Homeland Security before the Committee on Government Reform U.S. House of Representative, May 11, 2006.
DHS is working closely with its Federal partners, especially the Department of Health and Human Services (HHS), the U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA), the Veterans Administration (VA), the Department of Defense (DOD), and the Homeland Security Council to prepare and to ensure that we are coordinated in our response.
As we coordinate, we recognize that each Department has responsibilities that are unique as well as some responsibilities that overlap. The DHS responsibilities are clear, pursuant to the Homeland Security Act of 2002 and Homeland Security Presidential Directive-5 (HSPD-5). As the domestic incident manager, the Secretary of DHS will coordinate the overall Federal response to a pandemic in order to ensure the continuity of our government, maintain civil order, preserve the functioning of society and mitigate the consequences of a pandemic. The Secretary of DHS serves as the principal Federal official for overall domestic incident management. In this role, during a pandemic outbreak, the Secretary of Homeland Security is responsible for the coordination of Federal operations and/or resources, establishment of reporting requirements, and conduct of ongoing communications with Federal, State, local, tribal, private sector, and nongovernmental organizations.
[snip]
The Secretary would also set up a national planning element composed of senior officials of relevant Federal agencies to coordinate strategic-level national planning. The Secretary would also likely establish as many as five Regional Joint Field Offices that would be staffed and resourced with a Deputy PFO in charge of each Regional JFO to work directly with state & local entities. This framework provides a coordinated response for all level of government, non-government and volunteer organizations (NGOs), and the private sector. This system also affords full coordination between the regional joint field offices and military joint task forces that may be established. Last month, Secretary Chertoff asked his fellow Cabinet members to identify senior officials to coordinate planning and operations among the Federal departments before a pandemic would strike. The list has been compiled, and we look forward to working with these individuals as we plan and train together with our pre-designated PFO and Deputy PFOs.
I don’t think the military will be going house to house to take homeowner preps, at least not at first. They will be taking charge of large food storage warehouses to distribute it fairly, and especially to the troops, medical personnel, and other essential workers. But you can bet your ya-ya that if worst comes to worst, they will invade your home and take what they want. Just as not all of Americans are law abiding citizens, not all military personnel are either (think about the 14 year old girl raped and murdered in Iraq). It’s not the first month or 2 that I’m worried about, it’s the month or 2 after that. Also, some of my no good for nuthin in-laws found out I was prepping and have made rude comments (not to me but they said they know where they will get their stuff even if they have to use force, not in those words but similar) to the point where it frightens me. I will be watching out for them and in the meantime, no one else will know about the preps.
Preppers could talk about how they used to prep, but had a change of heart and decided it wasn’t worth it, and go on about how stupid it was for them to do that. It could throw people off of thinking they still have their preps. You never know, it could stop a lot of problems for you.
It’s called ACTing. (As in the Jon Lovitz bits on Saturday Night Live):-D
I think it’s also good for those of us with children to stress that they can’t tell anyone “We have tons of food in the basement”. I told dh that I was going to start getting groceries at midnight so the kids don’t know I bought snacks. Maybe I should do that so they don’t see me stashing the extra?
I have only told one person IRL that I’m prepping, and I only told him because he is the only one welcome here.
As for the EO, I don’t think too many of us will be bothered by it. What is the point of them taking my meager resources, when in the grand scheme it will less than a drop in the bucket. If I had a large farm, or grain stores (talking silos here) or some other large natural resource, then I would be worried. That’s not to say they wouldn’t bother me, but it would not be a good strategy. Would it be worth it to you to “allocate” a couple of buckets of beans, and put your men’s lives in danger? (We know how many of us here talk about home defense :) )
My father has told me just a few stories from his time in WWII. He was with Patton’s 3rd Army and was in the forefront of the liberation of France. He said that as they moved from town to town they essentially took whatever they wanted. He said that he got so good at running down chickens with his jeep that he could make them fly up and stick in the grill so he didn’t even have to stop to pick them up. In one town they discovered a huge hidden wine barrel and one soldier shot a hole in it and they took turns standing under the stream of wine with their mouths open. When everbody had their fill they just walked away.
While this was a completely different situation from what may happen during a pandemic, it may be very likely that a military force is stationed in your community. If they are there for a prolonged period and their supplies are meager or insufficent, you can bet they will begin appropriating what they can find. I’m not criticizing the military, I’m just presenting a possible scenario. I’m sure my dad’s unit had orders to treat the locals with respect and courtesy.
Monotreme – at 00:04
Thanks for the info.
For everyone else, just so you know the reason for my earlier comment concerning water resources, I work in the water industry and the Executive Order mentioned has the potential to impact this area. No, I do not believe the military or the Federal Government has any intention to seize personal preps. Now the no-good-fer-nothin-in-laws mentioned up above, that may be a different story.
EO 12919 was signed in the early years of the Clinton Administration. I don’t believe that a flu pandemic was even on Bill Clinton’s radar when he signed it.
A Vanarts…
I agree, but EO 12919 compiled many previous EO’s under it. As we know, EO’s have the same effect as law, if and when they are activated. It could apply to “any” emergency situation that we fall under. Sorta like Katrina, whereby movement of people, resources, etc. was controlled and the badly needed ice ended up in New Jersey or New Zealand or somewhere (-: What if you don’t want to give them access to your pond, well, barn, silo, food stockpile, etc. I would be outgunned, I do believe. Lay low, keep quiet, I think that will be the best policy now and in the event. And for those no-good-fer-nothin-in-laws, now that’s a whole other issue. We could shackle them and make ‘em work for their food…
The Captain – at 10:25
Thanks, now I have to add shackles to my prep list.
Medical Maven – at 20:06
Ya’ know… I’ve been given some thought to the “weight” issue. Sorta goes back to the times of plenty/skinny people are the “healthiest” and times of lack/fat people will survive! ;)- Seriously, when ya’ talk about survival… let’s say cavemen… it was those low metabolisms that were the survivors! Maybe it will be the fat people (oh… it COULD be considered a “prep”) who survive the famine (however the sceenario plays out.) All in all--- maybe “this” isn’t the time to shed those “unwanted” pounds. Save it for “then”… just a crazy thought.
I wish like h*ll I would have kept my mouth shut. My strategy now will be to relocate preps to different mini storage units with 24hr access. I’ll keep a weeks worth of food at the house and the other 11 months worth hidden in storage. Most of the people who are going to perish will perish in the 1st 6 weeks of the panflu; not from flu but from dying of thirst, starvation, or violence.
I thought about mini-storage units, too, but as far as I know they arent environmentally controlled. If you put your food preps in them they may freeze or be broiled in the heat. Non-food items, like toilet paper, etc., would be fine.
how will you get to the mini storage if there is no gas??!!
who will notice what you are doing there and mug you in the process??
would you really risk infection leaving your safe house to get your preps from a distant spot?
I dont think mini storage is a great idea! :-((
Jumpin Jack -
I recommend you think your plan through a little bit more. Once things become chaotic, there is no guarantee that the storage unit you have rented will still provide any access at all, or that they won’t have been ransacked by looters looking for opportunistic profits or consumables.
Think about it. If there is widespread disease, thirst, starvation and violence, then in all likelihood you “mental movie” of how you think things will go will not work out as planned.
For instance, the storage unit that I have acquired also has 24 hour access. It uses electricity to achieve this. I have stored no preps there, but rather expendable personal property that needed to be moved out to make space for the preps.
At one point, I acquired some bulky equipment that would only really be needed if the grid went down and stayed there. My DW wanted it moved to the storage unit. I argued strenuously that that would not be a good idea. it is now here, other stuff having moved out to make room for it.
I don’t know, if you have told a lot of friends and neighbors about your preps maybe the storage unit is a great idea — for now.
You can invite everyone over for an open house or some kind of party, and be sure to let everyone on a whole house tour. They can see your (pitiful) supplies, and you can tell them, I ran out of money so I ate all those preps I was telling you about; I had a change of heart, whatever — but feel I have enough set by for a TWO WHOLE WEEKS if avian flu pandemic hits! Everyone should do the same.
Make sure the food they can see looks really unappetizing.
Then later you can go back and get your food!
(-:
Prephider-
Some unsolicited advice in dealing with nogoodnicks:
Never bluff, never hesitate and don’t miss. Most bad people have no stomach for a real fight. To quote Gene Hackman in Unforgiven “I suppose you know, Bob, that if I ever see you again, I’m just going to start shooting and figure it’s self-defence.”
All the folks that know about my prepping also know I shoot Expert and I practice regularly. So does my DW, and so do my friends, who ARE invited to come stay during any troubles.
One of my coworkers once said he was just going to come to my place if TSHTF. I told him not to come without a specific invitation which he DID NOT have. He said “LMW, you wouldn’t shoot me for wanting to feed my starving family, would you?” To which I replied “Only if you continued to try to force your way in after you were warned!”
There was a long pause, and then he said “you’re serious, aren’t you?” I said I was. Cut to the chase- he’s prepping now.
On another note, if folks have the space, surplus 20′ x 8′ shipping containers cost around $2500 delivered in the greater DC area, and are a VERY sturdy and secure storage location. They are not particularly attractive, but if you have the room they are a very cost-effective secure storage location. I agree with Eccles, that after TSHTF it will be very hazardous to be accessing your stored preps. Much better to have them close by.
Went over to dinner at BIL and SIL’s place last night. We all had a big discussion over the terrorist situation in the Middle East. We briefly skirted around bird flu. (Never leave a chance to rib the ‘crazy’ prepper alone, I guess.) BIL’s statement about the bird flu. ‘It’ll be just like Katrina. We’ll need to survival loot what we need. We have plenty of ammo stocked. What about y’all?’
Sent chills up my spine. What will dear hubby do looking down his brother’s gun?!?
I am reminded of something I overheard many years ago, not meant for my ears, delivered with a big raucous laugh, so I don’t know if it was stupid show-off or the truth: “When in ***** (stars: country name), we pillaged, raped and killed”. Be warned. Keep preps secret or as little known as possible either from your fellow citizens or from anyone in authority. No other comment.
My standard reply since May: We’ve got enough preps for 2 weeks. We just don’t have the money to prep; we have to save for vacation in December. Seems to throw people off the scent.
I’m “lucky.” I have a ready made excuse for encouraging people to prep. Hurricanes.
I’ve tried … with various levels of success … to encourage people to prep water, if nothing else. We are now running into the “problem” though of having a very lackluster hurricane season after such as spectacular one the last couple of years. <sigh> People are really letting their guards down.
I can see the same scenario playing out in other types of prepping. Unless there is something “in their face” most folks put it on the back burner … some until it is too late.
BRMM- Ammo together with the skill and the means to expend it should be a standard part of every person’s disaster preparations.
The accounts of thugs looting those better prepared after Katrina really had me shaking my head. What were those people thinking? Under normal conditions about 1 in 100 will injure you or kill you to get what they want. During emergencies those proportions can be expected to increase. Prudent people prepare for “civil unrest”
LMWatBullRun - 12:55
We live near Gainesville, GA, THE Poultry Capitol of the World. We ourselves have plenty of ammo ready, too. Having been inundated with Hurricanes since Hurricane Hugo in 1989, there is ALWAYS civil unrest after the hurricane. While watching the images of Katrina looters, I came to the realization that I too would be out looting baby supplies if I’d been stuck in New Orleans with no money for prep.
It was just disturbing to hear BIL say that about the looting. They’re not prepping for food or anything even with a 6 month old infant in their home. HOWEVER, he’s fully prepped on ammo. I’m sure that there are a lot of people in my area that are like that. My area of the Blue Ridge actually reminds me of Afghanistan and Iraq. It would be almost impossible to throw a blanket over an area that backs up to 1000s of acres of national forest. Let’s hope that everyone will be focused on the poor b%$#@%ds in Atlanta.
“Patton’s 3rd Army … essentially took whatever they wanted… discovered a huge hidden wine barrel and one soldier shot a hole in it and they took turns standing under the stream of wine with their mouths open. When everbody had their fill they just walked away.”
Military in a war zone tend to be young, and have a sense of comaraderie that excludes civilians, so whatever you have is theirs because they saw it, the fact that you (non-military) are standing there as owner doesn’t register. War zone means the usual rules of society don’t apply (the troops say to each other).
I worked with the miliary for several years. A lot of the lower rank troops had a moment by moment sense of reality, and little awareness or interest in how their actions would affect other people. Like, one guy would take a card out of a deck (belonging to the recreation room) to light his cigar with a flourish. I pointed out that meant no one could use that deck to play cards. He looked puzzled, and said that didn’t have any effect on his cigar lighting ability, so what’s the point? (I handed him a thick piece of paper and he was equally happy to use that to light his cigar, but he still didn’t understand why I was telling him not to use a playing card, when that works just fine to light his cigar.)
Translated to prepping, I guess this means if the military come looking for food, assume they will waste/damage a lot of it right in your presence. Like, if they see a big box of cookies they’ll take what they want and throw the rest on the ground not out of spit but because having taken what they want they’ve lost interest in the remainder, it is of no use to them and in their world that means it is of no use.
If the time comes, be aware of the human tendencies to abuse power, reward self, and waste free supplies, before offering any of whatever extra you have to the people in charge. Find ways to make any offers in a way that limits these potential abuses.
As long as you have a gun you have a choice in what your fate may be and how you might want to spend your last few hours or moments. You might not prevail, but you ultimately will not be somebody’s object of abuse, derision, slavery, etc. “Life at any price” has been tried many times, and it has been found wanting.
MM- Perhaps a new screen name- Patrick Henry?
LizB
Scary thoughts, thanks for posting.
LMWatBullRun: Only if I get to play his role in real life. Otherwise, as far as I am concerned, Mr. Henry is in the clouds far above me with the rest of The United States Founding Fathers.
MM-
Yes indeed. “The gentlemen cry ‘Peace, Peace’, but there is no peace! Our chains have been forged to our wearing! Their clanking may be heard on the plains outside Boston! What would the gentlemen have? Is peace so sweet or life so dear as to purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take, but as for me, give me Liberty or give me Death!”
LizB-
What you describe has been common to armies throughout history, which was one reason the Founders viewed standing armies or ‘select militia’ as anathema to a free nation. Technology may have changed in 230 years, but people are the same now as then. ‘Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely!’ (Lord Acton?)
During WW2, one of the armies fighting in Europe cut the heads off their dead opponents and stuck them on steel spikes to decorate their tanks. (hint- it wasn’t the British, or the French, or the Germans or the Russians. It was the US Army)
LMWWatBullRun:
The real question is did PH actually fight regularly or did he just give speeches? I mention this as my tolerance for fiery rhetoric lately is zero. Give me a real leader-one whose in the dirt with me. I don’t know the scoop on ole Henry.
I posted a URL in the CFR thread I thought you might like to read. The Army’s assessment of the 1918 flu complete with charts for soldiers by state, disease, etc. Excellent medical history read if you’re interested.
Saw your comment there Leo7 & will check it out. Have to check my history books but I think “old Thunderer” did serve in the field, but I’ll have to check that.
My story is I am collecting a “care pallet” for the victims of the latest “disaster” in the news. That the “agency” hasn’t come to pick up my donations yet. Conclude by saying I will be so glad when the stuff is out of my house. End of story.
Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.
Lord Acton, Letter to Bishop Mandell Creighton, 1887
LMWatBullRun – at 23:12 Bravo!
Doing a quick search on Patrick Henry finds that he led a Virginia militia in 1775.
What was interesting to read was that the phrase “Give me liberty or give me death” may not have actually been uttered by him but written by a biographer after the fact.
bump
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