Okay, it seems justifiable to start a thread for us folks who are going to have to (probably) SIP in an apartment during the possible pandemic.
If you are one of these people, please post here so we can get to know each other! If you are a newbie and an apartment dweller, please post here.
We need to share solutions we have each found amongst ourselves.
So: who else will be in an apartment (any kind of multi-story, multi-unit abode)?
I know myself, Woodstock, Grimoire and STH are…
Add me to the list. My second bedroom is being taken over by prep.
this is where i live: http://tinyurl.com/hg7zo You can see the potential, though i have worries with so many people in one area like that.
Oh! Woodstock! Fantastic! And so full of life and fun and culture! What an incredible contrast to my plebian Penrith. I lived for a while in Bondi Junction and it was fabulous, and so near Bondi Beach, too! (Murderously high rent, but.)
You simply must put up ‘Flu free Zone’ notices! Surely there are opportunities to network where you are?
any other apartment dwellers?
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So, how are you finding space? Water takes a lot of room and I don’t have much. How are you solving this?
I live in an apartment. And I live by myself. I have relatives, including parents, who live in the same metro area. They expect me to bug out with them and go up to their lake cabin, but they are not preppers.
Also, they have neighbors at the cabin. One of the couples is elderly (80+), and I’m sure my parents would help them if they got sick, thus exposing themselves to the virus and potentially me, if I were there. My parents don’t listen to me as it is; they certainly wouldn’t listen to me during a pandemic.
So for those reasons, I’m debating staying home. I live in a Twin Cities suburb. I don’t expect that things will get terribly bad here as far as law and order goes, but you never know. Downtown Mpls. or St. Paul would be a lot worse. I’m more worried about getting sick if the Avian flu goes pandemic.
The main problem with an apartment is lack of space for preps. I have a very well-stocked pantry and medicine cabinet right now. There is a storage closet down the hall (outside of my apt.) that I could use if I had to. Everyone here has one.
So, ideas for security? I have pepper spray. My door is lockable, but locks only keep out honest people. If TSHTF, I will move some supplies to the storage closet and my car trunk, and not keep all my eggs in one basket.
I’m not in an apt currently but will be again probably late in the summer, and then for awhile… not sure what I would do about water storage — already I have three boxes full of preps — and that’s only 3 months worth of beauty/hygiene/supply stuff.
I’m a minimalist, so I hate having extra “things” around — makes my head feel cluttered. I haven’t had too much time yet to figure out storage solutions, other than putting in boxes with labels (to keep inconspicuous) and keeping track of what I store in what box.
Hmm, buying a car to keep more preps in…but then someone could just as easily break into the car, which is quite likely in a public riot situation.
Mostly I’m just worried about having to SIP with other people above/below/behind me and not having control over what they do — whether they go out or not, etc… maybe I should think about what other sorts of tenants are already in the building before I sign a lease…
I’m not storing water at the moment. I’ve got a backpacking filter bottle, some water purification tablets, and some bleach. I’ll probably just catch rain in a bucket or something and then boil it if there is electricity to do so.
Well, I may try to catch some rain for washing, but it doesn’t rain here much. I bought some of those collapsible plastic 5-gallon water jug thingies. It wasn’t a bad deal because I didn’t have to pay shipping—you can order from REI, then they send you an e-mail when it’s at the store and you go pick it up. I also found some info on what contaminants are in the river here and printed out some stuff on water treatment; if necessary, the river water could be treated and used.
I know exactly what you mean, ricewiki, about clutter making your mind feel cluttered! I’m not crazy about the boxes I have stacked up in my bedroom, but I don’t have anywhere else to store my supplies. What I’m trying to do is donate some of my OTHER clutter as I add flu clutter: burn through my huge stash of novels and magazines, lose weight so I can donate the bigger clothes, etc.
Melanie,let the bathtub fill with water when panflu hits.Screw hooks in your ceiling to hold buckets with water. EmilyH, sign a clear treaty with your fellow-lodgers about what’s done in a pandemic !
How about self-storage facilities to solve space issues? Usually can enter/exit without any human intervention, relatively cheap…etc…
Good luck all - I was in a highrise condo in downtown toronto until i bought a new house just outside the city. Different set of issues for each.
make lists, what/where you would like to be when panflu hits. Maybe you can do arrangements for lodgement-changing with others for the case of panflu. There _should_ be these lists available already somewhere, maybe a small local journal or internet page. It’s unlikely that your lodgement serves your needs for normal AND panflu, so it makes sense to change lodgements with others including prep-stuff
Hey, a fellow Canadian — don’t forget to check out the Canadian and Ontario preppers threads, Oskar! nice to meet you… I lived in Toronto for a bit too….
“Melanie,let the bathtub fill with water when panflu hits.Screw hooks in your ceiling to hold buckets with water. EmilyH, sign a clear treaty with your fellow-lodgers about what’s done in a pandemic !”
Um…the last thing I want is for all my neighbors to know I’m prepping. I don’t want people coming to my door looking for stuff. Not to mention, I don’t know anyone except my immediate neighbors.
I like the lists idea, but I don’t plan on leaving unless I absolutely have to. I do have a bug-out-bag packed.
I don’t currently live in an apartment but did for a long time. If you need extra space, I suggest putting the bed on risers — I’ve seen in many catalogs and shops the risers that raise a bed a few inches — that should give you room to store extra essentials. I’d definitely put a dust ruffle from the bed to the floor so that the stuff can’t be seen — and thus keep things from looking cluttered. Any little bit of space helps.
Emily,your neighbors might think the same about you. When they know you are prepping they might be more willing to organize+cooperate. Looking for stuff could also be offering to trade stuff.
Having lived in an apartment for a number of years and now in a small condo, I understand the space constraints and have a few suggestions.
First, you all know how to fill up every drawer you have that you don’t really use….the one in the kitchen that’s your junk drawer can hold a LOT of tuna cans! The little drawer in the bathroom in that cute little corner table can hold a lot of matches, etc.
Also, I think someone mentioned that you can replace your coffee table with 4 plastic buckets with a piece of plywood on top & a tablecloth over it and also have space underneath the plywood for other buckets of supplies.
Another thing is to put a false back in your closets (you may have to make the coathangers hang at an angle, but you can take 1″x6″ boards and attach them to the back of the closet and fill them up with canned goods. If you’re afraid of someone seeing them (like the bug spray man that has access to your apartment) then buy a piece of sheetrock and cut it to fit your closet and put it in front of the narrow shelving for cans to hide the entire back of the wall, basically making a false wall.
If you can convince your landlord to let you, or just do it and worry about your security deposit later, you can cut in between the studs in the walls, add small board pieces for shelving & store food, money, supplies, etc. in between the studs.
Put an empty can that held asparagus on your refrigerator shelf (with spare keys, money, copies of family phone numbers, bank account info, or any other information that you can laminate, roll up & store in the can — I’ll bet 9 out of 10 people will NOT pick up a can of asparagus!
For larger and more reachable storage, use the ‘puddling drapes’ idea to decorate your windows. Hang a decorative rod over your window and let it extend out from the window on both sides, as wide as a 5 gallon bucket — about 12″ on either side. Fold yards and yards of fabric (the thicker the better, like a tapestry material — that will still ‘hang’ properly but have enough body to not give away your secret. Let the fabric puddle on the floor a little and behind the vertical panels stack plastic boxes on top of each other to the top of your curtain rod, using the fabric to hide the buckets from sight inside the room, and from view outside your window, you could even cover those buckets with that contact paper that looks like woven wicker so that if someone sees them they’ll think you’re using them as columns or something. Work with the idea until it fits your window.
As time draws closer, put a wooden shelf on top of your bathtub — I use our guest bathroom in this way to keep our pet carriers handy but out of sight & I’ve found that having 2 pieces of wood that fit one on the left of the tub rim and one on the right makes it much easier to remove the 2 pieces from the tub without whacking off the water faucet or something. You can store items you don’t really think you’ll need under the boards, and stack up toilet paper, food supplies, etc. up to the top of your shower curtain. Then take sponge baths or set up a camp shower type thing, using one of those square pans that you put under washing machines to keep them from ruining your floor if they leak. You can get one at Home Depot or Lowes for around $30 — they’re pricey but they work and you can empty it and store it behind a door for your next shower.
Decorate your house with decorative tins — find ‘em at your thrift store and set ‘em on tabletops, desks, kitchen counters, over the fridge, in the bathroom, etc & fill with whatever supplies you can use in that room……they’re great for rice, beans, gravy packets, or whatever comes to mind. Be sure and load up your mantle display with them if you have a fireplace.
If you need to hide something sort of large (propane tanks, etc.) get one of those mesh laundry baskets that have supports in them so the basket stays open. With some thread, baste clothing from the thrift store around the inside of the basket to make it appear full, then slip whatever you want to hide down into the bottom of the basket — it could be those ‘vittles’ holders someone mentioned that hold dog food and stack on top of each other(from Petco & other type pet stores). Put as many as you can into the ‘laundry basket’ and just toss a clean sweater or sweatshirt on top to hide the fact that the hamper really isn’t being used for clothes — you can get away with having up to 3 of these since people tend to sort clothes into whites, lights and darks! Same with recycling bins.
Clothing travel bags (you know the black vinyl ones that zip up over your coathangers - you can hang hospital scrubs or full body coveralls and masks in them and hang on that hook on the back of the bathroom door that you don’t ever use (the hook, not the door!).
If you have planters, take a piece of styrofoam & cut it to fit just inside the top of the planter, then cover it with florist moss, stick some artificial ferns or flowers in it and set it on top of the planter, using the space below to hide supplies. This is easy to do in a bathroom where you want to hide medications!
Line your bookshelves with those cardboard boxes made for photo storage — look at Michaels or a party or paper store, etc. and store supplies there instead of photos.
Oh back to the fake wall at the back of a closet, if you have the money to throw at this, you can buy those tall white plastic coated wire pantry baskets and nail them into the back of the closet (you can get them at any Home Depot store) and use the narrow baskets as your shelves so you don’t have to cut and install narrow wood pieces for shelving. Once they’re full, cover up with that piece of sheetrock - you can also cut that piece of sheetrock down the middle for easy removal later, just tape it together with sheetrock tape, paint it the color of the other walls in your closet. You can even caulk around the edges to give it that finished look and no one will know it’s a false wall.
This is sort of elaborate and ‘out there’, but if you have stairs, and can somehow remove the treads without damaging them, you can attach those white wire baskets that hang under your cabinet shelves that give you more storage. Attach them to the underneath side of the treads, load up, set the tread back in place & reattach it carefully.
If you have a fireplace, load it with supplies, take art and cut out a “fireplace screen” and cover it with decorative fabric that you attach with spray adhesive. Anything to keep people from seeing into your fireplace and that will be an easy to reach storage place — unless it’s freezing weather!
Decorative baskets along your kitchen cabinet tops……..a stretched canvas painting on wooden stretcher frame hanging on the wall could have shallow pocket shelves built into the stretcher frame with skinny things hidden there — how much pasta and cheese & mac pkgs will one canvas painting hold!? Or you could use those vinyl shoe caddy things that hang on the back of a door and store stuff in the pockets — lotions, shampoos, toothpaste, etc. - just make certain the stuff in the pockets isn’t thicker than the stretcher frame because you don’t want the painting sticking out from the wall. These could also be stitched into the top back of a tapestry wall hanging or a hooked rug hanging…..anything that is stiff enough to hide something behind it without it’s shape showing through to the front.
Inside your washer & dryer is space (if you have those in your apartment).
Stack up modular storage cubes that have solid sides, backs, tops, and bottoms, and alternate them for shelving against a wall. One cube turned outward with cd’s in it, the next one turned backward, hiding bottles of alcohol, the next turned out correctly with your battery operated tv, the next turned backward with toilet paper, the next turned out correctly with your wind up radio & a candle, and the next turned backward hiding 10 lbs of flour. Then start the next row up and the next and the next!
The one thing to remember in an apartment is that you’re not the only one in there — management most likely has the right to enter the apartment at any time, so does any pest control people or maintenance staff, AND they probably have the right to show your apartment to prospects out apartment hunting — I used to be in the apartment business so I know — especially if you plan on moving sometime & haven’t renewed your lease! One way to avoid being the ‘showhouse’ is to keep the front room slightly messy with ‘unsightly’ things like dirty socks, Kleenex on the floor, soda cans turned on their side (washed out first of course) — make it look like you’ve turned into the bad side of the Odd Couple!
That’s all I can do for this brainstorming session.
What other ideas can YOU come up with??
I forgot to add that if you’re forgetful, at least make a master list & hide that where you’ll be able to find it easily…..possibly in the dark if there’s a weather emergency. If you have a collection of something like pet rocks for instance, instead of grouping them together, leave one on top of each tabletop throughout the house to remind you that there’s food in the piece of furniture it’s sitting on. No one will wonder why they’re not together & you don’t have to scratch your head wondering what you did 6 months ago when hiding your supplies in the first place!
wow. that is an amazing set of ideas, I’m-workin-on-it! Amazing. Impressive brainstorming.
My apartment has a basement. Good place to stock pile stuff for pandemic. I just got a solar powered light that goes outside can be brought inside for light. It runs for 15 hours.
Oh i forgot to mention. I came home today from a weekend visit to sisters. And my husband was planting a garden for vegetables. First time I ever seen him plant vegetables. Makes me think he is preparing in his own way. We have tomatoes and parsley. I suggested zuchhini and cucumbers. Any other ideas. The garden is small.
birdwatcher, I would suggest lettuce because it has several advantages: it doesn’t need as much light as plants with “fruits” so you can put it in a place that’s lousy for growing other things; you don’t have to wait very long before you can start using it; and we can use dried or canned vegetables for other things, but there’s really no replacement for lettuce.
thanks can i grow that on a porch garden?
Yep, that’s what I’m doing. I have lettuce and green onions in clay pots on my little balcony. There isn’t enough direct sunlight for tomatoes (bummer!), but the lettuce and onions seem to be doing great. In fact, it’s already at the point now where I can thin it out and make a salad with the stuff I take out. I got a package of mixed lettuce seeds at Wal-Mart, so that I could have a variety.
Another plant that would do well in a pot is a bell pepper. Needs more light than the lettuce, but it would be a nice addition to the plants that you already have.
My little herb garden goes in this weekend. Fresh herbs can make bland canned and dried preps taste like cuisine. What doesn’t get used this season goes into the freezer for later use.
Birdwatcher: may i suggest sprouts? Will grow damn near anywhere and take very little space.
Hi, my name is Felix Gillette. I’m a freelance writer based in New York City. I’m currently working on an article about how people around the country are preparing their houses and apartments for bird flu. I’m hoping that part of the story will be about what people have already done to prepare their own personal homes. And, also, a service section about what people, who haven’t yet made any preparations, can do to get started. If anyone here is interested in being interviewed, please contact me. felix_gillette@yahoo.com. Thanks.
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Just starting preparations. Will fill the tub when things get close. Will also have to get some type of water container. I see garbage cans are not recommended for drinking. So maybe a garbage can for the toilet water etc. The tub water for drinking…
I have a storage space away from the apartment. All supplies will be boxed before I ultimately bring them in to conceal contents.
I went to home depot and got a sprayer for bleach and disinfectant solutions.
The carpet in the unit and in the hall outside the unit presents an issue. I may spray it if the flu comes. Probably spray it on a daily basis I will tell the neighbors.
I have disposable masks for me and the immediate neighbors. The masks will have to be disinfected regardless of government statements to the contrary. There may be no choice after a few months of lock up. Alchohol spray. I have masks for the neighbors for self protection and promote calm.
Also have cans of Lysol professional spray from Sam’s. Will take this with me in backpack to clean car and self if necessary. Seems to be mostly alcohol.
The biggest challenge (after accumulating all the foodstuffs AND DIALYSIS SUPPLIES) will be the dog.
To handle the dog I am going to create a decon stall out of plastic sheeting and get a blow up kiddie pool to spray down the dog with a pet friendly disinfectant. The dog will need to get its feet decontaminated and bleach is not the thing to use.
Once the dog is cleaned and dried, I will need to remove outer garments, bag them and get them decontaminated. This may be in the kitchen sink with bleach. After putting them in the sink, I will spray the whole kitchen with bleach.
The dog will need three walks a day. So this is three decontaminations and 3 sets of clothing a day. This will require lots of disinfectant and time
Wife and I will probably need to stay apart as best we can prior to vaccination. Separate rooms. Continual masking and gloves.
Once I have acquired foodstuffs etc, I will turn toward getting a generator (yamaha), gas cans and siphon for getting gas out of car. Also need to continue acquiring pet food.
I currently use Vonage. At the first sign of the outbreak, I will switch to phone company. Cable and cell will go before phone service. Change from broadband to AOL etc.
Questions: Has anyone created a decontamination stall? What are apartment dwellers doing for security? And when will you stop going to work? Any employer is going to be the last hold out at the job: “I am still coming in, why cant you?” When do you pull the plug?
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What do you think of this link?
Weight Considerations
We live in a big apartment. Space for preps is not our main problem. I have scattered our preps all over the place. Racks in the big store room near one wall, cartons of juices and milk against another wall, crates of 12 x 1.5 liter water bottles stacked four high in an unused shower cubicle attached to the children’s bathroom (they use our bathroom)etc. I try to spread the weight of the preps, especially the water, to minimise the strain on the building. The building is reinforced concrete, five storied, and we live one floor above the garage. Is there a rule of thumb of how much weight one can store in one place ? Should I also consider the total weight spread around the whole apartment ? It’s the water that is the main problem and the most critical prep ! Any structural engineer around ? TIA !
Some low impact suggestions for general apartment storage (I lived in Manhattan and Brooklyn at one time…)
Use the space between the kitchen cabinets and the ceiling.
Install shelves about 12″ from the ceiling along walls in bedrooms or bathrooms, and put stuff in decorative boxes on the shelves (plus a plant or two if there is enough light)(This can create alot of space.)
Use trunks for end tables or coffee tables
Install an additional cabinet over the toilet
If possible, hang wine glasses from an under-the-counter rack to leave extra space in cabinets. (Some people hang the pots and pans too.)
Eliminate things you haven’t used in over two years and won’t help you out in an emergency
Consider moving stuff you can’t part with, but don’t use on a annual basis to an off-site storage facility (aka Mom & Dad’s basement, or the office for books you have already read.)
Buy things in smaller containers so they can be shifted around more easily (aka the 55 gallon water drum is not for a 400 sq apartment - but 1 Liter containers of water can be stashed more easily in the back of linen closets, etc.)
If I was in an apartment now, I would opt for the collapsable water jug option, and plan on filling them when things begin to look bad but before the water supplies are on on ‘boil only’ status. Also, if there is an individual hot water heater inside the apartment, this can be used in a pinch.
Hi fellow apartment dwelling wikians. First up, here is a link to my present apartment complex - http://tinyurl.com/pgnh5. Use the map section and zone out a few clicks to find the number one reason I feel I have no choice but to bug out at the first sign things are going hot within the USA.
I’m right under the Philly International flight path (planes pass over at around 1500 feet on final). This creates a nice international mixing pot on the mass transit to Philly which crossing over the Delaware River into south Jersey. Mass transit passes through the heart of Camden, NJ, a 4-minutes train ride to the local platform. Quick spread seems likely.
Now understand Camden has been the winner of the “Most Dangerous City in America” designation for several years, despite sincere efforts to change. Our “boro” is considered pretty safe, but there is not enough buffer between that danger and us when TSHTF. The fast ways out south Jersey to the south are over toll bridges on I-295 to Delaware or into Philly and then south on I- 95 or west on the Pennsylvania Turnpike. Military vehicles blocking the tollbooths can quickly close off all these routes, which there is little doubt will happen if the zone goes hot. If I wait I will be stuck with about 3 million people with limited resources (and a lot of bad people with high-rate of fire weapons thanks to the on-going drug and gang activity along the Delaware River).
The apartments themselves are problematic. These buildings are concrete slabs built in 1950. Normal water pressure is low above the 4th floor. Frequent false fire alarms have people wait to see the fire department show up before deciding to walk 10 flights of stairs to evacuate. Building make-up air comes under the entry door, drawn out by vents in the kitchen and bathroom. Three unreliable elevators will literally have to be hosed down with bleach solution on a continuous basis for decon, as will the entry areas. If Avian flu breaks out, all entries and exits will spread infection throughout the building.
Units have individual through-the-wall heat and A/C units like a hotel room. The one in my 5 year-old daughter’s bedroom keeps pulling in smells of cigarette smoke (It must be coming through the block wall cavities). Windows do open. It didn’t take long for the air to grow stale and humid in power outages. We can normally store 2 weeks groceries in the tiny kitchen. We end up storing overflow items on the little balcony. It’s so cramped as is to grate on our nerves in normal living. If the flu doesn’t get us, cabin fever will.
I moved here in desperation when my financial situation turned really bad back in North Carolina 4 years ago. I could only find a job for 60% of my old pay outside of Philadelphia. That made it such that we only afford a 2-bedroom rental for a family of 4. I burn inside when I think of how much safer my previous home would have been and how much easier to prep and defend it was.
After evaluating my situation, bugging out seems the best choice for survival. I’m basing my plans that. The best-case scenario will be that the hunt for a new job I have started lets us move about 200 miles south to a new location, even if it means moving just myself at first as I did here. I would then evaluate and start preps before moving my family, as my wife wants to be near her family at this time.
I’m not far from two ghettos and do not plan to sip in my apartment complex. It’s too dangerous here as it is and I need to spend my money on food not self defense. If I lived further out in the suburbs or in a rural area I might stay in an apartment complex. I’m afraid riots and violent gang break-ins for food/medicine will be a reality for many unsuspecting, unprepared people.
what are you guys doing about storing fuel (cooking, maybe space heaters, etc.)? Do you think that it would be safe to store the 1lb propane canisters in your apartment (they’re stored indoors at Wal-Mart). Do any of you have any cooking/heating fuel plans? Thanks for any info.
Nope, and if the owners find propane in our units we will be living on the streets. Different rules apply in a pre-crisis world, where fear of an explosion is more important. We can’t even have a charcoal grill on the patio. Like I said, I’m bugging out.
I’m a lurker, and just found this thread. I wanted to add in my two cents as a prepping apartment dweller! I hope you don’t mind it being a bit long :-).
We plan on SIP once things get critical. I have managed to stockpile 3 months of food and water, and am working on more by doing the following:
I have purchased 360+ gallon-sized Ziploc baggies (12 boxes of 30) - the freezer kind, with double zippers, work best (NOT the actual zipper ones - those leak - but the ones you press together). These are food-friendly, and will be filled at the first sign of TSHTF. I am also buying 2+ gallons of spring water per week and filling every 1- and 2-liter soda bottle I consume. I am storing those in our second bathroom which we currently don’t use, as well as under beds/crib. And plenty of bleach for disinfecting tap water. This will provide our drinking water.
For non-potable water, we will immediately fill all available containers asap after the Ziplocs. Right now I have eleven 15-gallon storage bins that are holding my kids toys, old clothes, and food prep. I plan to add at least 9 more of these. These are the ones you can get at Walmart/Target with the lids.
These bins are also fantastic for prep supplies and they are pretty cheap - I have one for each category. I then stack them along any empty wall space - nice, neat, out of the way.
I will also get an inflatable kid’s pool as we live on the bottom floor and have a fairly large space out of our back door with great rain run-off. Thankfully mgmt doesn’t object to these type of objects.
As for walking the dogs - mine simply go right out our sliding door and we flush their poops - we have to “scoop” it anyway, and this is better environmentally. Because they are small dogs, if it becomes necessary, they will use papers inside for all of their needs - I’m stockpiling those to - currently they reside in our spare tub with lots of cardboard. Worse comes to worse, it makes great starter fuel!
Our second bedroom is located very conveniently right inside the front door and there is a hallway before the living room. It has its own bathroom. If my husband needs to continue working (he travels nationally), it will become a quarantine room. He will basically stay in that room for 7 days, or until he leaves again or heaven forbid gets sick - I will curtain it off at the end of the hall, so he will come in and never go past that space. All comfort items will already be in there, with a small fridge, computer, TV, etc. available. I’ll simply move the boys into our room and camp out on the couch if necessary. We can use the sliding doors to leave if necessary. This will also work well as a sick room thankfully.
On a side note - we are lucky in that my husband will probably be able to telecommute once things get bad, plus he gets a total of 6 weeks vacation/disability that we are saving for this purpose. He is in a field (computers) that has quite a bit of flexibility, and works for a very large company that already has some plans in place.
We have a small Weber grill that we can use outside - our apartment opens to a space of about 12′ by 20′ that goes to the parking lot. One side is a large bush/hill, the other about 4 feet of rocks. It literally almost feels like our own backyard, and if anyone is in that space, they’d better have a reason! I’ve stocked some charcoal as we normally grill 1x week during summer anyway. We also have a small propane grill with 4 small canisters. But I don’t intend to do much cooking when SIP - I’m prepping with no-cook stuff when I can in case of no electricity, because…
I’m concerned about our safety should someone realize we have resources - hence the limited cooking - so we do have protection and we both know how to use it. When it comes to the safety of my family, I won’t be asking a lot of questions if I see you peering in my sliding doors. The dogs are a big help here as well - they may be small, but they have large barks (dachsunds) and they never shut up, lol. I also want to get my pool out early for the boys to play in so it doesn’t look too suspicious. I figure when it becomes necessary, I will let it fill with rain while “guarding” it, put the water into any empty containers, and then bring the pool back inside.
Hmmm…that’s it for me - water was the toughest thing to consider, but then I remembered how I used the Ziploc’s to freeze breast milk with no problems. I’ll simply stack them in the closet on some plastic in case of leaks, or anyplace I can find - it won’t matter asthetically at that point.
Now I’m trying to convince my husband that 6 months wouldn’t be a bad idea…he’s starting to come around with this new Indonesia stuff.
Suze35, excellent post. I’m utilizing all space underneath furniture for ‘short’ or flat stuff as well as food safe buckets that I can stack on top of each other to conserve space. There is another thread for condo & apartment dwellers as well with other good advice.
IGNORE THAT LAST POST - I was confusing this flu list with another one. Sorry.
Lots of great ideas there, Suze35. I’m a little bit concerned, though, that your water storage containers might not be sturdy enough. If you stack up filled gallon baggies, I’m afraid the ones on the bottom would split; even if you only stack them, say, 4 high, the one on the bottom will have 24+ pounds of weight on it. And I just don’t know if those plastic bins can hold 120+ pounds of water. Is there any info on the labels about how much weight they can take?
Those are great points STH. I couldn’t find any actual weight capacity numbers on the bins (they are Sterilite’s), so I will test one out to make sure they can hold the water. They are pretty heavy duty plastic, but it’s important to know for certain.
I’ll give the baggies a test as well - if I need to, I will just spread them out around the apartment I think. They can also “stand up” a bit if need be, so I can put a single layer in a box, which we have plenty of from our move (hubby doesn’t throw anything away, lol). Or I can layer them in drawers and take the clothes out, etc. What I like about the baggies is you can take one and put it in a small space, making it easier to stash in an apartment.
It’s great to get this feedback!
Just did a test with the baggies of a stack of four - at least initially, they held up very nicely - no leaks. I also dropped one into the tub from shoulder height (about 4.5 feet) and it didn’t bust/leak.
I’ll keep them in a bucket and see how long that lasts. So far it seems that at least 2 deep is totally doable :-).
Just did a test with the baggies of a stack of four - at least initially, they held up very nicely - no leaks. I also dropped them from different heights - about 2 feet was the limit before they opened up, so that would probably be as high as I would stack them.
I’ll keep them in a bucket and see how long that lasts. So far it seems that at least 2 deep is totally doable :-).
If this is a double post - I stopped it to correct the drop height!
Please keep us posted on how they hold up, Suze35. I’m looking at water storage options for my apartment, too, and trying to keep costs down.
In the meantime, I’m enjoying the image of Suze dropping water bombs in her tub. :) I can just see myself doing this test as well—all three cats would be fascinated and crowd around to watch, at least until one of the bags broke!
I thought the baggie idea was a good one so yesterday I bought a case of bags from Costco (I swear I was the only one buying any kind of preps) and some small aluminum pans firguring I’ll fill the baggies & put 2 layers in the pans and shove them under my sofa which sits fairly low to the ground. It’s just one extra place to stash!
STH - yea, my dogs started barking :-). Sounded like a shot! Thankfully I’m on the ground floor.
IWOI - the aluminum pan idea is great - I’ll have to pick some up. They would also be useful for other things too, like keeping water for washing dishes or bodies, etc. And I use them a few times a year normally, so no money wasted. I think I have only ever seen one person prepping (two loaded carts), but then I’ve been discrete myself - no more than a few gallons of water at a time, bags of cans that look like regular groceries…I just go 2–3 times per week.
So far so good with the baggies - everything has held up overnight. I plan to leave them for 30 days stacked in a bucket for my test - I figure if I stack them 3 high, that will be 120 stacks. Four baggies per day usage, roughly 30 days stacked that deep. So if they pass my test, all should be good :-).
I’ll start testing a bin tomorrow, but probably only for a few days as my husband won’t like having it lying around I’m sure, lol. I’ll let you all know how it holds up!
I wanted to update my Ziploc test - I found I do get some leakage with 3 bags stacked, although not true failure. I am trying 2 stacked, but the overall footprint is about the same as two upright, so I am going to go with that just for safety sake. I don’t mind having baggies everywhere once TSHTF, if I can just keep the kids out of them, lol.
bump
I’m thinking of starting a thread to ask the homesteaders and scientists about ideas for those who will be in apartments. Most people on this site have their own homes. We’re definitely the minority here. Rather than just community-build, it would be good to have some direct answers and solutions. ‘’ The premier question is/should be:
Can a SIP be effective in an apartment building or multi-plex? If so, to what degree?
for me this is the key question. I don’t even know what the main factors are to consider. We need input from architects, plumbers, heating and ventilation people. If the answer to this is NO, then I need to seriously overhaul my entire plans and consider taking out a mortgage so I can have my own place.
Thanks for starting that other thread ricewiki. I have felt kinda worried about not having the resources some others on the fluwiki seem to have. It feels that sometimes people have assumed everyone reading has the resources they do. I admit some envy of those, for example, who have land and can safely store kerosene, propane, or gas outside as advised so that they can cook and be warm indoors.
I don’t think I can bug out to friends because despite solid efforts haven’t been able to convince them to prep…and I couldn’t supply a family of four or five. IT’s hard to invision SIP with starving kids and not giving up all I have. Don’t have close family to SIP nor a ton of money to provision friends…tho any advise around that would be appreciated.
It was good then to read the advice somewhere to use a tent and put it up indoors. I got a tent and warm sleeping bag and lots of old down comforters, as well as warm clothes and a plan to wash and dry them if need be (I dont’ have a washer dryer either!)
I bought canned heat (note that sterno and ETOH evaporate) so I will get some more in the fall. BJ’s (like Cosco, big food and more wearhouse, a friend with family had a membership) has a case for pretty cheap of sterno. On the web there is an (expensive)product called Heat Cell that doesn’t evaporate and is even safer than sterno. All three can heat up a room supposedly (the ETOH to 65 supposedly). SO to warm my apartment. I will live mainly in one room and have material to block windows from drafts. I wlll burn one of those indoor fuels just enough to get chill out. And wear lots of warm clothes.
for cooking, I will buy a thermos and heat to boiling indoors with above fuel. If it feel safe, I can cook on Hobo stove with a few pieces of charcoal on my porch (with sand bucket and vigilance, porch is wood) I bought 1.5 gal waterbags from somewhere on the web for water. I was thinking of a trashcan and triple liners to fill up if THSHTF…30 gallons of water stored for 14$. There’s been talk that regular trashbags arent’ food grade, but I think I personally will take the risk. I also am saving 2L soda bottles and buying and using water this summer in clear gallon containers (Poland Spring is only one) which I save. I bought rubber drain stoppers to keep my tub and sinks from leaking, as all of those and all containers will be filled if the worst happens.
for safety, I have recently had extra locks put on my doors and am investigating getting security bars for one accessible window (I am not on first floor, luckily. Not that this might help (I hear firearms enthusiasms laughing…) I will be buying a metal baseball bat and get a battery operated tape recording of my friend’s pitbull barking. Thats my best. And keep trying to inform my friends so they will prep,at least for themselves. I am prepped for a year almost done. I need to start getting out to the community more. I frankly had assumed living in a big city (Boston) with large medical establishment (2 miles from most major hospitals…is that good or bad for me do you think?)they’d somehow be on the ball, but now I feel the need to find out and do what I can.
hi again, saw that in inital post ricewiki adds..”..any multistory…multi-unit abode”. Hope to slip into this thread anyway even if there are only three other apartments in my building, which is only 2 floors. Our main difficulties are similar..lack of space, lack of land, close quarters. Many of us are likely city-dwellers also. Just want to Belong somewhere I guess…;)
Hey jplanner you are welcome! for sure….
Thanks ricewiki. you are famous, all over the fluwiki! ;) am honored, and tired have been up all nite, goodnite!
jplanner, I’m going to be in an apt. myself for at least the time leading up to the possible SHTF. Haven’t figured out what to do after that. It’s starting to seem that chicago will be a bad place to stay in even if you ARE prepped. Of course all the speculation about public unrest may be overstated. I have no way of knowing. I will have to keep my ears open on the wiki and find the best way to leave. Luckily I am used to city living and its congestions. Many times found cabs and rides at the last minute. I’m always planning alternate routes to places I need to get to.
It’s been a long time since I’ve lived in an apartment but one thought comes to mind. There are certain tasks that you usually call on the janitor to fix. Well, the janitor may not be available or you may not want to break isolation to let him in.
Make sure you have some tools to handle problems which you could fix yourself. For example, make sure you have a plunger for the toilet and maybe even a “snake” if your toilet is subject to getting plugged up. Plumbers tape could be useful for pipe leaks.
Oh, and a small fire extinguisher, kept in the kitchen, could save your life or be the difference between continuing to have a place to live or being homeless in the middle of a pandemic.
Irene! VERY good points!
jplanner, with the hobo stove on a wooden porch, how about getting bricks or paving stones to put your stove on?
thank you jane, i will put my stove on something heat proof. Problem with cooking outside is that have three neighbor buildings each within twenty feet. Might as well put up a sign “I have food hear, come get it!”
..but perhaps the sign would be spelled better!
What if one or more of your neighbors gets BF?
Our next door neighbor moved out recently and the vacant unit got re-painted. Believe it or not, we could smell paint fumes coming out from the electric sockets fixed against the common wall between our unit and the next. Assuming that the BF is/will be airborn, I am sure I will have to plug up whatever cracks, sockets, vents, etc.
What do you guys think about a possible breach of your safe space via the sink, toilet and/or shower/tub drain?
Also, if trash collection stops for a long period of time, then problems arise including the following:
1) Piled up trash bags by the trash shoot/bins can attract bugs, rats, etc. 2) Your neighbors may start burning their trash in their patio and cause a fire hazard.
These are the things that I worry about when I think about SIP’ng in my apt. Any thoughts and/or solutions???
I live in a tiny (650 sq ft) 2nd story apt in a 12-unit building in Atlanta. I am lucky to have a balcony, and plan to use it to:
I plan to burn my paper trash in a metal bucket that I picked up at home depot. May have to do this outside on the ground if I am using propane from the balcony…
Plan to get a composter for organic matter. Still don’t know if it will need to be kept indoors or out - may depend on the weather. May be able to dispose of some paper this way, but probably not all, which I hope to be able to burn, if necessary.
Fresh vegetables will be a problem for apartment-dwellers. I have bought a spouter, which should provide very nutritious, fresh greens even in winter, if it is not too cold in my unit. Just need the seeds, and learn how to use it! Also, I bought a dehydrator, so I can have broccoli, green peppers, carrots, etc, almost as good as fresh. Hope to store them in containers that I can use up within a week or so, to prevent food from going bad once opened. Am planning to “preserve” the dried foods (as well as rice, etc) with either dry ice or dessicants / oxygen “eaters” - I forget what you call those things. Most veggies should be blanched before drying. Since most frozen veggies have been blanched already, I am cutting out this step by drying frozen veggies when on sale, then throwing those in my dehydrator. Still very new to this, so any advice out there is appreciated!
I have made a list of all my preps & their storage location - it will be impossible to remember everything I have purchased, and where it is located!
If you plan to SIP alone, you will need lots of reading material, games, etc, to keep your spirits up! Also, a radio that does not need batteries (get the crank-up kind)…it will be imperative for you to be able to stay in touch with the outside world & know what is going on! Also, it will help you to feel less alone after SIP for a few weeks or more. You will also need to know when it is safe to come out in public again…
Calandriel – at 22:04
Your range hood may not work, if electricity fails. I hope you are planning to cook only on your balcony. Sprouts may have samonela risks - please double check what needs to be done for safety. Didn’t see anything about water storage. Also, shower water heating - consider getting a solar heated shower bag from camping store. If your balcony faces the south, building or buying a solar oven may be worth looking at - so your fuel supplies last longer.
Calandriel, that’s some really good ideas! I’m live in a condo over in B’ham & understand some of the weather conditions you must cope with! I LOVE the idea of the escape ladder as a way down to avoid close contact with people….would you just leave it hanging down while you are gone?
I’m-workin’-on-it Yes, I’m afraid I would have to leave the ladder hanging while I’m out. The door can be locked, though, and is a deadbolt.
Anon-YYZ Yes, I have a camping stove which is a multi-fuel type. Plan to use propane, but also have a dunk for gasoline (currently empty, but will fill) and Sta-bil. I also bought a pressure cooker set, to help cut down on fuel usage. I have two types of solar cookers, too! These might be ineffective on my balcony, as it is shaded by a HUGE oak tree, but I can use them on the rooftop if things get that bad. Your idea is a great one about the solar water heater…I’ve debated getting one due to my shady location, but now I think you’re right, and that it would be a wise investment. I’ll just have to put it on the roof (and hope my neighbors don’t start coveting my preps!)…Thanks for the tip regarding salmonella & sprouts - didn’t know about that risk! I’m starting my very first batch of sprouts ever this morning, so your note is very timely!….I have stored 18 gallons of distilled water in a storage locker downstairs, and will move all preps up to my unit when TSHTF, and also have 20 five-gallon collapsable containers, to fill up while H2O is still flowing & chlorinated. There is a downspout that runs 2″ from my balcony, so I plan to divert rainwater from that source should I need to replenish my water supply. If there is no rain, there is a swimming pool a mile down the road (this would be a source of last resort.) I also have ordered a stainless steel, non-electric distiller so I can purify water from just about any source. Hopefully, it will work with one of my solar cookers. I really need to test my preps!!
I am very interested in getting a Xantrex type portable battery with some solar panels to run either a small tv or mini-fridge. I could mount the panels on the roof & throw the electrical cord over the side to reach my balcony, where I would place the battery for recharging. Does anyone have any suggestions about what items I would need to buy to make this work? Eccles is a wonderful source of info for this type of thing, but I’m having trouble finding efficient appliances - you have to know what the load will be before you can determine what kind/quantity panels to get…
Calandriel – at 10:29
There was an old thread about converting a chest freezer into a fridge by putting a temperature sensor in the freezer to stop using power. There is also another idea storing frozen water in 2 litre (pop) bottles in your regular freezer and with the onset of power failure, move the contents of the fridge and the frozen pop bottles into a (newer) 5 day cooler. Without power, the food will survive a few days. As for solar electric, your best bet is to post your question to Eccles’ thread. As far as TV goes, there are personal LCD models around 10″ that round of 12 volts. I haven’t got it, I saw it once on eBay.
The most fuel efficient way of cooking (other than solar) is to use a Nissein (not sure about spelling) Thermos Cooker. It’s about the same size as a pressure cooker, but you only need to heat the contents of a stainless steel pot to boil for a much shorter time than a pressure cooker, then insert this pot into a tight fitting double walled stainless steel cavity with an air tight lid (the thermos). Let it sit for several hours. Again, please search for ‘thermos cooking’ on this forum for details. This type of cooker is more likely available in Chinatown in your area (made in Japan). Just ask around.
Had a flash of inspiration last night (Teething baby up at 3am. She fell back asleep in 2 seconds, leaving me wide awake to stare at the ceiling and worry about the BF.): I have a fondue pot! And if a fondue pot can bring cheese to a boil, than it can certainly do the same for just about anything else. I have a burner underneath that uses burning alcohol (or sterno, but the alcohol is cheaper and can go a long way, although whatever you don’t burn up just evaporates.) Anyway, thought I’d mention it to the other apartment preppers who can’t store fuel or use grills in their apartments… My first two large bottles of alcohol are now lurking at the back of the bedroom closet.
We need a summary of this thread for Pandemic Flu Awareness Week (which will be mid October). Just so we may help a number of people, right?
City dwellers have more internet AND are more fragile (sustainability-wise), no?
ah the old ricewiki thread…one thing about storing alcohol in cans for fuel folks, it’s not good for very long term because it evaporates even if the can is sealed. Mine six months old are ok still. lugon please clarify…or I will go check that thread later (because I know there is a Pandemic Flu Awareness Thread) but maybe others who hit this one, newbies, don’t understand what you mean.. I guess we are summerizing everything important?Yes city/apartment dwellers are in very precarious position with this.
I guess I just pretty much did it myslef, sorry Lugon!
I lived in NYC apartments my whol elife until just 2 years ago - I have been so moved by all your hard work on this thread. You all living in small spaces do have an extra burden to shoulder. I prepped for Y2K in my apartment - water and some food… the water (Poland Spring gallon containers) leaked after a couple of months. arrgggg
Although I don’t live in an apartment I read this thread with interest. Anyone with limited space can learn from it and hopefully share their ideas too.
We don’t have space for gardening so getting fresh vegetables is going to be a problem. We decided we are going to concentrate on V8 juice, spirulina tablets and sprouts to supplement our diet.
I read the concerns re sprouts but we get ours from a source we trust and I am also getting food grade hydrogen peroxide to wash the peanuts, almonds and sunflower sprouts. I personally HATE sprouts, or thought I did, but discovered the broccoli, radish, lentil and nuts sprouts are pretty good and pack a powerful nutritional punch, as do the spirulina tablets, for someone with limited time, money and space. (hope this isn’t an inappropriate post for this thread)
sam in az, that’s interesting. I’m dehydrating fresh veggies and fruits right now — or at least I THINK I am….I’m following the directions & so far so good — that will be my way of having ‘fresh’ in a pinch.
I may have to check out the sprouts.
opinions?
i live in a multi-unit apartment dwelling in an otherwise somewhat rural area and have been prepping for some 6 mos now, feeling as tho i’ve made enough progress to be capable of thoroughly SIP-ing w/my young child for about 4mos thus far.
however, i have concerns, having made all these preparations, that where i live could be a hazard simply for its proximity to other apartment dwellers. the doors thankfully open to the outside, tho i’m sure on cool moist days the air itself could maintain virus for sometime, so will try to only go out on bright sunny days and follow all manner of precautions. we live on the top floor with only one aptmnt to each side and one below, so perhaps droplets wouldn’t be so much a risk as would aerosol?
i’m hoping most of the college kids here in the building and the building beside us will leave should an event take place during school months. i have plans to cover a vent in the kitchen leading to outside, and a vent in the bathroom leading up to who knows where, with plastic and duct tape should pandemic arise.
i am concerned however this thing might be able to creep-up around pipes in the bathroom and kitchen. tho the apt seems relatively air-tight, am i correct in being wary of this possibility? how likely is it the virus could penetrate walls, come through outlets, etc? should i consider duct-taping all plugs as well?!
i have the option of bugging-out further north in the woods of Maine tho feel certain other family members would be considering same in the event. i also don’t enjoy the thought of having to SIP in a location not my own home. i realize that’s a silly attachment, given the potentials, but would feel more comfortable here with many different forms of activities for both my daughter and i and don’t think it’d be likely i could transport all these sorts of items in one trip north, let alone all the preps!! we also have limitless supply of water here, with a kick-ass filter, and are surrounded by options of fish, wild game, edible plants, and hundreds of small farms. i think i’d feel safer here perhaps than in the deep woods where many armed individuals might begin roaming lone houses for eats at some point.? SIP-ing with one other (small) individual (and no pets besides a beta fish, thank gawd) would also reduce other possible human w/in the household as potential vectors.
i’m banking on this town largely clearing-out and the locals helping each other out to whatever extent possible as this is a great area like that already.
it’s difficult however, to get perspective on the situation. how horrible would it be…anyone’s guess? to SIP in a multi-unit domicile, even if direct contact with neighbors would be possible to avoid?
is this like, front-row seats to the apocalypse or a relatively safe environment i might be able to control to some extent? (in the apartment, there are mainly two windows and one door accessible to break-ins. much easier for one person to consider defending this than would be a whole house with many points of entry.
should tsrhtf in a worst-case scenario, i would not be sleeping very well as the sole adult in a household, needless to say, but it might be like that no matter what in a wcs.
so…any thoughts/opinions would be greatly appreciated. i used to worry about the waterfall mist beside us which occasionally hosts water birds here spraying avian version H5N1 into aerosol form around outside…and am pleased to say that since reading extensively on this site, i have become much less concerned about the avian version of this thing, even if it were to take residence in the pond/river 15 yards from my front door. it’s the uman beans i’m concerned about.
thanks all. and cheers.
oh, our heat is electric in the walls, with the option of gas. i’ve also acquired zero degree sleeping bags and a small propane cooker/heater which i’m not sure would be an option inside but is at least there as an option, and we have carbon monoxide alarms.
point being, i don’t share some sort of central air heat with the rest of the aptmnt.
just trying to reach some level of peace w/my plans to SIP here.
thanks again.
I live in a senior apt complex, composed of all ground floor 4-plexes. In a town of 4500 people. I’m the youngest one here at 48. Most are in their 70s & 80s…no one prepping that I can tell…no one but me, and my mom, who also lives in an apt here.
These apts are very tiny, but since it’s just me and a huge cat; I’m free to stack boxes around everywhere I want to.
I have put up long metal curtain rods ( from Home Depot ) and hung sheets for curtains; to block off my dining room from view. That room is almost stacked to the ceiling, along with an 8 x 5 x 8 walk-in closet, a linen closet, under the bed, and in 1 small closet. I figure I can go for about 10 months so far.
I also have a storage unit “right” outside the door; with boxes of things in it that won’t freeze…but can be brought in at the last minute, if need be.
My mother is moving closer in the complex to me, with 1 other tenant in between us, so we could communicate by yelling or with different colored flags, (?), if need be.
What my next worry is; is windows ! We have 1 steel entry door, no windows, but double windows in 3 rooms. I guess preps for November will be pre-cut plywood and door bracing. I can always “make” a table out of it with more buckets underneath. Nearest family is out of state; and will not prep for the BF; so my mom & I have no choice but to hunker down here. Bugging out will not be an option as she is in a wheelchair, and I’m not walking much better.
Sorry, that Anon was me— Madamspinner……. The more I think about the signal flags, the more I think it may work for us. My mom is hard of hearing, so yelling wouldn’t work with her.
bump
Water: for apartments there is not a very smart thing to store water now.. A pandemic is not a kind of “of switch”, any problems with infrastrukture will not happen at once. But what you will need are containers, (preferably collapsbe ones) to fill up if there is a pandemic. you will have “plenty” of time.. And get a Doulton cermaic filter (only the filter for saving space, the bucket system you easaly make if TSHTF) will give you the possiblity to filter any water for drinking, so that will mean that a lack of clorinatuin of the tap water will be no problem). This plan saves you a lot of space. And when there is a real pan happening you will not be bothered by using by rooms that is filled up with water since you will have more important things to worry about. After all this may take time, and you are also suposed to live a ordinary life in your flats, right now,.
Food: go for dry beans rice and pasta in bags. Canned and cardboxed food takes much space. Rotate food, and put all of it in small square plastic tight storage system, 3–4 months of basic proteins and carbos etc will only take a small cabinet or drawer for one person. The rest of the food is for variation, quick preparation and good life.
Cooking: Get a small camping stove for mulifuel, and buy 2 gallons of lampoil( kerosene/parafine), its safe storage when kept away from strong heath. And is the less place konsuming fuel for heath and kooking. Plan to kook in thermos. Those two gallons will keep you warm for months. And the thermos also prevent food smell that will tease your hungry neighboors.
Light: Get a heavy big Maglite, its good for any emergency, and is effective tool for blinding and hitting people.
If you have a car, when time for SIP bring your fully charged carbattery (please get two of them, so you may use the car just in case) into the flat, and use for LED bulbs that will last for months on the charged battery. As long as the battery is not charging you may place it anywere in the flat. If you charge it with a charger, some small ventilation is needed during charge)
Plan to use a few standard extension cords (the ones you use on the high voltage system right now) (but in when in use as emergency light, keep those two complety separated by marking them with some color and a note.) You will only use this sytem for testing and in case of black out.
Use two or more ordinary lamps with E27sockets. Get theese LED Bulbs that is for 12v system (like a car battery), just screw them in the lamps when its time. E27-W24–12V Low Voltage LED bulb [[ http://www.superbrightleds.com/cgi-bin/store/commerce.cgi?product=MR16 | shop window, order this one:E27-W24–12V Low Voltage LED bulb, ]]
get one extension cord and cut the wire on the male side. Strip the plastic and put on some large crocdile clips ore just twin the copper around the poles of the battery. The polarity dont matter for the LEDS but other apparatus for 12 V will need corect polarity, so if you plan to use such (like a celphone charger for car use etc, you will conect it strait to the battery with a sigaret lighter female plug, with red+ wire on red+ pole. In the extension cord system is complicated to know witch polarity is witch…
The lamps with LED bulbs may now be conected to this extension cord using ordianary spread cords etc, and may be used to put light in more than one room. (maybe covering the windows with some black plastic sacks will be wise, if you are the only one with lights…..) If this sound complicated ask a friend with some knowhov to fix it ready. But its very easy to fix, and is hard to mess up. The Bulbs are litle expensive but will last forewer.
So that should cover all the basic needs.? Done this way your flat will not be like a private shopping mall, and full of stash :) And LED light is the safest thing, if you use candels there is allway the risk, with LEDS you may fall aslepp with good faith.
Here’s a good source of info for alcohol backpacker stoves. http://zenstoves.net/ I cooked rice and lentil soup for two on about 1 once of fuel. When the fuel ran out I covered the pot with a heavy towel for instalation and cooked for another half hour. You can cook and get heat at the same time. Brown rice, seeds. lentils and beans can be sprouted and eaten raw or use less fuel to cook. http://www.sproutpeople.com/index.html and Walton Feed has info. Ken
Madamspinner – at 13:22 Great job!!! You’ve been a busy girl! I think the flags would be good….if you get a chance, consider looking at baby monitors for the two of you to use so you can sort of keep track of what she’s doing. You might also think about moving in with her, if people in your area start getting sick, with bug-out-bag-type set-up and fill your apartment up with last minute stuff then use a baby monitor in your apt so you can tell if anyone tries to bother your stuff in your apt.
I’m-workin’-on-it – at 20:35
I thought about baby monitors and the walkie-talkies, but they take batteries. I’d rather spend that money on other preps. ;-) I can sew the flags !
As far as moving in with the woman--- in all honesty, I’d REALLY rather die of the “new Flu”…..there’s just NO way I’m moving in. Besides, 90% of the preps is in MY place !
We are on the fourth floor of a mega apartment complex. We have central air in our common hallway and we plan to seal our front door (which faces the common hallway) when SHTF. We have one window (in one of two bedrooms) that is right next to our neighbor’s bedroom window. We plan to keep that window closed but leave the secondary bedroom window and the living room patio window open to ventilate. I am worried about someone causing a fire hazard, so we will keep our car ready to go (we plan to store some gasoline on our patio in case someone syphons our gas out of our car). Also, to address potential fire hazards, we plan to have extra fire extinguishers.
I have read about people who have survived the 1918 flu living in an apt so I know one can make a go at it! I am more optimistic about SIP’ng in an apt than I was prior to doing some reading on the net. :)
bump - is anyone’s apt building (or city/town) discussing emergency preparedness?
(I know what the chances are of them using the Pandemic word)
Good luck (and good neighbors/neighborhoods) to you all.
SUNPREP
The newer cars are just about impossible to siphon gas out of; but learn how to disable your car, to keep the WHOLE CAR from being stolen ! Have a mechanic show you how to remove the points ( under the distributer cap I believe ) . That way, a thief can not tell what’s wrong…they will look to see if the distributer cap is there ( which is what most people will pull.)
If they can’t start it, they can’t steal it !
I don’t live in an apartment but I really believe it is important to prepare in the city and apartment setting. The survival of our civilization depends on your success. That said, I recommend stocking up on bleach for disinfecting toilets, sinks and bath tubs. You need to do more of that than in a house as the vapors could come through the plumbing from another apartment. If you have central air, please consider getting extra plastic (vapor barrier) and duct tape to seal off any vents that connects to the central air system. CO and smoke detectors may be hard wired. If so, consider getting extra battery operated ones. This is more important if you plan to use camping stove for cooking. Some one here said butane is slightly safer (for CO) than propane. You may want to investigate that. In either case, I think you need to have some windows open.
crfullmoon, my fathers second residence is a condominium townhouse in Williamsburg, Virginia. I was up there last June when school was out. The Association President lives across the courtyard. He came over shortly after our arrival and asked my father to fill out a couple of papers. They had aleady sent them to Dad down here in Orlando but he didn’t respond. They were asking how many people Dad and stepmom would be willing to take in during an “emergency”, how many could use the dwelling if they weren’t there, etc.
Needless to say, my father politely told him that he would not be taking in any flu patients and they did not have his permission to enter his dwelling if he weren’t there. This was all under the heading of “Emergency Preparedness” but we both took it to mean pandemic based on the verbage and questions. I advised that if he isn’t there he needs to not worry about it. The place will surely be broken into and if he’s lucky only the food and water will be stolen and not everything else. It is nicely decorated.
It’s crucial that you work your plans around the apt. or condo rules as much as possible since, on the other end of things, you don’t want to be held responsible for property damage and things like that.
Madamspinner: Thanx for the tip on disabling the car. I will have to investigate further and be sure to disable it when the SHTF!
On a side note: I am planning to compile a document that talks about the likelihood of a pandemic and also talk about safety in SIP’ng in an apt (such as don’t burn trash bec. of fire hazard and noxious/harmful gas being emitted, plugging up all vents, sockets, etc.) and leave them in front of apt resident doors (probably during the wee hours when no one can catch me doing it!) Hopefully that will get people to prep and start thinking about safety issues. :)
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good info in this thread and I hope some people will revisit it & add to it ideas you have!
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