Flu Prep XI filled up pretty fast, so we have an all new thread. Flu Prep Ekks Eye can be found here.
bird-dog ¨C at 23:06
Lisa in Southern Maine ¨C at 22:57 from yesterday
Sorry to take so long to get back to you¡ nope, I haven¡¯t finished the crawlspace yet - sigh. After reading BB¡¯s posts on mold i was even more reluctant to get ¡®down and dirty¡¯. It is sooo dank and is on a very hard-on-the-knees ledge. I have to crawl down in there every month or so to change my water filter(iron, etc.) and I¡¯m convinced that an unknown species of mammal lives there too. I scan the dark with my flashlight but have yet to pick up some eyes. Anyway, I did borrow a staple gun and started to reattach the insulation.
My main prep yesterday was to check out my finances¡not good. I¡¯m planning to cancel my newspapers since I read them online anyway and to only eat out once a week. I¡¯ve also broken into one to my cheap nicotine gum boxes and will only buy a pack of cigs in an emergency. I have a trip to Mass General this coming Wed¡.that may be the day! Naaa. I¡¯ll chew my gum. Lol
It really felt great to organize some preps today (batteries, propane cannisters, tool kit, tackle box, and books) and to get out of the buying mind-set. I still always need more toothbrushes and sponges, plus an axe, Silk in boxes, and quilted shades(!!!), etc., etc..
After reading tonight about the ¡®Stage 4¡ä news, I may be tempted to do a Whole Grocer and Wild Oats run tomorrow. Whoops, on second thought, no¡ I also suddenly have a seriously cracked tooth so I¡¯ll need to pay for that first! Thank God I¡¯m not SIP now! I can¡¯t eat well and it hurts like crazy. Ate some 90 second rice tonight. Did the trick. Appt early tomorrow thank goodness!
As for baking bread,,,I used to eat somewhat macrobiotically and baked unyeasted bread¡ª25¨C30 yrs ago! I¡¯ll be happy with chapati¡¯s. I¡¯ll drag out my Tassajara Bread Book and reaquaint myself. ;-) great book!
I¡¯m so impressed with Kathy in Fla. and Average Concerned Mom!! ¡®You are amazing!¡¯ Thanks for the ideas!!!
Every one is amazing here, for that matter!
Hey BB, ayah—we say ovah heah in Maine too!
LOL!! bird-dog --- I actually picked that up from the Doc Holliday character that Val Kilmer played in the movie Tombstone, but I’ve heard Mainers (Maineians?) say it the same way! Mostly the Down Easters and lobstermen…
It’s lobstah in the local dialect.
mmmmm….I could go for a lobstah roll right now. yum!
I’ve been blowing through some prep foods because I just haven’t had time for regular grocery shopping (when does school start again? not soon enough! get these kids out of my house!). Another advantage of prepping! Still have some major items on my prep list that I’m not sure how we’ll pay for - $$$ are tight right now.
I’ll be out on Friday and Saturday … business trip with some fun thrown in. However, I’m planning to see if I can make our preps work better on the road.
All 7 of us (2 adults and 5 kids) will be going. I’ll have 5 road meals to deal with … we’ll eat breakfast super early a.m. on Friday at home. Cooking will need to be limited so will only take minimal gear. Will probably try and use some of my freshly dehydrated stuff to go along with anything “fresh” that I pull from the fridge. Milk won’t be a problem as the kids like the Creamsicle stuff I make with powdered milk. I’ll throw a container of juice in there to drink at dinners … throw a few gallons of water for the rest.
Hopefully this planned road trip will be easier than the unexpected one that we had to take last week. <sigh> The kids travel well, even the 2 year old, but it is still a pain in the back side this close to school starting.
Got a good test of my temporary tarp setup for collecting rainwater last night. A thunderstorm blew in about 9:30 pm, and it rained for about an hour. I also collected water from my roof, though I will have to use that with caution since the roof is asphalt shingles. (At least it should be OK for watering trees that have deep roots.) I got a total of 24 gallons of water from the tarp (it would have been more but I discovered water sloshing over the tarp at the low end). The PVC connectors are supposed to arrive on Friday - I’ll make a frame to support the tarp that will be much better than the bags of mulch and bricks that are holding it up now. I may make another one to fit on the driveway - the neighbors will have fun laughing at me scooping water at all hours.
The rain barrel that drains about 1/4 of the roof was about 3/4 full and I had various buckets collecting water elsewhere. If TSHTF, I’ll tarp the roof so that water would be treatable just with straining & bleach. I must have about 60 gal total off the roof. All of the water is now in milk jugs for ease of pouring (the good water) or plastic buckets. It was a lot of work, starting immediately after the rain stopped for about 1 hr to get most of the rainwater, and about 3 hr this morning for transferring the roof water from collection containers to storage containers and throwing out any debris or water that wasn’t clear after settling.
Based on this, I’d say water handling is going to take a significant amount of time if you’re collecting rainwater or surface water, letting dirt settle and scooping off the clear top part, and treating it. If you’re in a location that gets lots of rain and plan to use rainwater as a main water source, it would be worth working out an automated process, at least for moving water from a collection barrel to a storage container.
On my way shortly to pick up more used food-grade barrels. Two for my sweetie and one more for me, if I can fit it in the Subaru.
Here are some excerpts from a thought-provoking article on the fragility of the good life that most of us are leading, by Victor Hanson. Perhaps it can help convince someone of the importance of prepping…
“But could our good life really sometime come to an end - as the histories of past affluent societies suggest it will? Imagine al-Qaida attacking the New York Stock Exchange or an unexpected North Korean missile taking out a West Coast city. What if Beijing suddenly had to sell off billions of its accumulated American dollars? Or how about a good old 1970s-style recession in which interest rates hit 20 percent, with inflation and unemployment each hovering near 10 percent? What would millions of younger Americans do - people who have known only the prosperity, material surfeit and mostly peace and security of the 1980s and 1990s?
In our own new age of war, terrorism, huge debt, high-priced gas and frightful weapons and viruses that we try to ignore, we should remember that civilization’s progress is not always linear. The human condition does not inevitably evolve from good to better to best, but always remains precarious, its advances cyclical.”
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2006/07/the_fragility_of_the_good_life.html
Mari – at 11:29
Thanks for the results of your field test. This just points out how important it is to try our plans out now so problems can be corrected and the results can be tweaked.
Mari, thanks. Water is one of those huge problems that have been difficult for me to address.
We have an inground pool so I think we are OK for non-potable water, especially so if I redirect any run-off. It just so happens that the pool is very near two downspouts from gutters and it would be a simple fix to mate the downspout with soem pvc pipe to run the water through a screen and into the pool.
I’ve GOT to find a solution for drinking water. We’ve got the tarps that are big enough to go on the roof … but a really odd roof line as the house has been added onto about four times over the years. Its correctly engineered but odd to try and tarp effectively for run-off if you get my meaning. We’ve gotten back into our afternoon shower cycle in our area, but that doesn’t last all year. Still need to come up with solutions for the times of year when water from the sky is less likely.
Has anyone suggested this? Or would it be practical?
Rainwater collection using an old trampoline frame, putting a tarp or heavy plastic on it instead of the trampoline mat. Put a hole in it in the middle, and weight it down somehow so that the rainwater runs to the middle and drains into whatever.
They sit up high enough off the ground that buckets, or kiddie pools could be put under them easily. Buckets could be lined up to be filled.
Wonder if folks with an unused trampoline would be willing to sell them?
Those things are certainly big enough that they would work. I would think that to avoid problems with high winds you would need to firmly anchor the framing … but you have that issue with any tarp set up.
Certainly worth considering.
Kathy in FL – at 12:15
Do you know the average monthly rainfall in your area? When we were in Orlando on vacation it seemed like there was a pretty good downpour just about every afternoon. An 8′ x 10′ tarp will collect approx. 42 gallons of water from a one inch rainfall. That’s 6 days of water for your crew. Now, if you had two tarps feeding that collection device, you have doubled that amount. How big is your yard? Sure it would look like a gypsy camp, but it would be worth it.
AlabamaPrepper – at 13:59 - One problem in my area is hail. Another area of town had penny sized hail last night that made the ground white. We also routinely have 50 mph winds. I’m keeping my tarp lying on a concrete pad, weighted down with rocks & bricks, hoping that will help. I’ve seen hail shred a lawn chair in a couple of minutes.
Are you planning to be underneath the trampoline moving a filled bucket to make room for an empty one? Remember how heavy water is.
One way to potentially move water from its collection point is to use a 12 volt utility pump. I have tow, that I got from harborFreight. these pumps run off of either a 12V power pack, a battery bank or a car electrical system, and can pump about 240 gallons per hour really far laterally, or about 20 feet up, or some combination. Then, you don’t have to go out in the rain, just let the pump move the water through 2 garden hoses, one for Goes-inta and the other for Comes-outa.
Reading all the comments here brings to mind something I’ve seen in a few of the backyards here in FresNo, and also seen in some of the “high end” home improvement catalogs that we are constantly being bombarded with in the mail (and, yes, I do read them…something about wanting to be able to spend $350 on a 12-inch glass ball for my garden just intrigues me…).
But I digress…one of the most amazing things I’ve seen is called a ShadeSail. They’re made of a lightweight, weatherproof canvas, and hung from 3 points to provide shade over a patio area. Their angle can be adjusted from two of the three points via a pulley system to provide shade at all hours of the day.
Now, since this device is triangular in shape, and it’s height and angle can be adjusted, this just might work as a way to catch large amounts of rainwater. It would require a couple of posts to be buried upright in the ground, but the benefits of providing shade in the summer and being able to catch rainwater during the rainy season (which in some places is the summer) far outweighs the cost of placing a couple of 4×4 posts in the ground. Even being canvas, which isn’t completely waterproof, you could layer a couple of plastic tarps on top of the fabric in order to catch all the water.
Just a thought….
Bird-dog - your cracked tooth is a reminder to ua all to tweak any health issues. My preps this coming month are the human kind - physicals and Flu and pneumovac for boys, optometrist to make sure younger boys prescription up to date. They’re good on dentist - checked 3 months ago. Consulted with friend who is physical therapist about how best to excercise these boys while in sip. Have purchased - well, a Mainahs ideaahh of puchase which is going to transfer station community recycle shop and making goods exchange - weight bench and dead weights for them, and treadmill now cleaned up. PT suggested I set up a good and heavy sand bag in basement for them to use too. I’ll get to that in coming month. It does feel good to organize preps, doesn’t it? Gives clear idea of how far you can go. Take care of that tooth.
Bronco Bill - any idea of cost on shadesail? It sounds like a much easier solution than others I’ve considered, as does Alabama Preppers trampoline idea (which is really creative and resourceful!).
I’m working through freezing the flour and rice we bought at Costco and wishing we had room in the house for an actual freezer so I could do more than a one gallon Ziplok bag at a time.
And…what’s “rain”?
Check before you buy shade sails as they can be very porous if they’re knitted material versus woven. They may not be strong enough at the gromets to support a tarp and rain. We plan on tenting our swingset on both sides and using garden poles to get a U shape at the bottom to funnel the water into storage tanks. So no matter which way the winds blow we should be able to capture rain water.
Check harbor freight for shade sails—we got several—made out of umbrella like fabric—for a little less than $20. you could cover them with a plastic drop cloth for water collection. We just use them for shade—works great!
Oh, by the way, another “lesson learned”. If you use a rock as a weight to keep your tarp from flying around in the wind, use a smooth one.
Thanks all for shade buying tips. And Mari - I have a return tip for you. When people say ‘you can freeze eggs’, they don’t mean buying a box and sticking it, eggs whole, in the freezer. Live and learn:)
I guess if the shadesail is fairly vertical, the water would run off instead of staying there, weighing on it.
Jane—
closer to the equator, the more horizontal the sail? I went out and looked at the one we have pitched over the south side of the house and it is at about 40 degrees; it could be configured to funnel rain water into a barrel.
I had some overtime on this week`s check.// So ,I went shopping.
I now have a dehydrator, a propane camp stove, and the cannisters to go with,another lantern, not solar this time. And lots more food.And scored 4 tubs with lids from Safeway`s bakery for free. Free is nice!Look to be around 3 gallons.// I also can`t walk in my kitchen.:-),Guess I know what I`ll be doing tomorrow.But, tuna at 20/$10.00 was too good to pass up, along with other loss leaders.// I think I have enough vittals to do me for about 6 months. So, I think I`ll start on extras for whoever. Beans and rice are cheap, along with Ramon noodles.// My 5 gallon bucket was positioned under a runoff spot ,and it got filled. As my average yearly rainfall is around 7 inches, don`t think I`ll plan on rainfall to meet my water needs,tho.My tomatoes in pots on the patio will enjoy the rainwater.They seem to have a growth spurt after they get some.
I bought a portable toilet with hand pump, detachable tank and a camp shower. I told my wife that we can charge the neighbors one can of tuna or corn to use my new BF potty if TSHTF.
Warm shower? That will be one box of mashed potato flakes and a jar of spaghetti sauce.
Does that warm shower come with soap or do I have to provide my own ? And, how about back washes? :-)
Soap- free. Back washes- I give back one can.
depending on the backs of course. ;-)
depending on the backs of course. ;-)
I was gonna ask about that, but I’ll just shut up…
And as Eccles pointed out, you will want to have partial rolls of TP in all denominations to “make change.”
HillBilly Bill – at 07:35 - LOL! Gives a “roll of quarters” new meaning! BTW, I was once at a party and the host had stocked the bathroom with “joke” TP with dollar bills printed on it. Maybe we should find out who makes it . . .
My latest project is making labels for all the food that I repacked into mason jars, buckets, etc. Originally, I stuck cheap masking tape on the containers with an expiration date but with all the humidity, the masking tape has started coming off and I realized new “stickier” labels are in order.
knowall – at 08:03
I cheat and just write on the lid with a marker the contents and date. I do right it small enough that I can mark it out and right something else next time its used.
Knowall- I just write on the glass with a Sharpie pen. The Sharpie can write on glass very well. In the future, you can remove the ink completely by just using isopropyl alcohol (That also works to get Sharpie and many other markers off of hands and other accidentally marked places.
Eccles – at 08:37 -
Thanks so much Eccles, that’s a great suggestion and much easier than stickers, no adhesive gunk to remove later. I didn’t know Sharpie Ink comes off of glass with alchohol.
Major prep for me this week-I officially withdrew my two kids from school and will be homeschooling them. Ive been very busy setting up a homeschool room, doing paperwork, researching and putting together a curriculum, gathering supplies and so on and so forth.
Although flu was not the reason I took them out, still it is comforting to know thats one less thing I would have to deal with if TSHTF-whether that S*** is flu, storms, energy prices, what have you.
Also have been getting in all those dentist/eye/physical type appointments. Went in for a routine mammagram and they found a small “nodule” Had it checked out and turned out to be a small benign cyst, probably caffine related, theres a familiy history of this so it wasn’t too surprising. Still-I can’t emphasize the importance of getting these checkups BEFORE flu hits. My hubby had to have major dental work done, that took several appointments over a couple of months.
Because of the homeschool room reshuffling, my preps have somehow gotten “rearranged” as well and are now all out of order. (One of my storage areas is now a Science lab) Also, I have been out of the house quite a bit, doing some community theatre work and to my chagrin I found that one of my snack-preps bins has been discovered and all the pop-tarts, cereal and oother goodies have disappeared. (Sigh) Also detected a major Ramon-noodle deficet Because Ive been so busy, Ive been lax about recording what I have-I have been tossing stuff in the freezer or in bins without writing it down,-not a good idea. As soon as I finish up with the homeschool prep, I need to inventory and re-arrange the flu preps again.
So much for those lazy days of summer! More like crazy!
With the heat and humidity, we still have plenty of “Hazy”
Ok, I’m getting giddy now, so I’ll hush up and go get some breakfast.
When it comes to removing the ink from Sharpies, Acetone (finger nail polish remover) also works very well. It was common practice in a lab I once worked in to mark flasks with a Sharpie, then rinse the marks off with acetone when cleaning up.
AVanarts - I have found that Isopropanol works even better than Acetone for Sharpie. I think it may be the carrier solvent used in the pens. We also used to extend the life of Sharpies by ading a little Iso back into pens when they ran dry.
We used to mark lab equipment with Sharpies. You could rfemove the marks completely with an alcohol prep.
Getting ready for the bird flu is nothing but hard work.
I canned 30 pints of corn relish and put 12 quarts of corn in the freezer. This morning, I picked more corn and tomatoes. I am going to can 24 quarts of soup mixture with corn, tomatoes, celery, onions and carrots today. I add potatoes later when I cook it. You can’t get this stuff in a store! Yum.
Are you aware that you can grow potatoes by simply covering them with straw? In some parts of the country, it is not too late to do so. Allow several months to pass…rake back the straw or grass clippings, and you have medium sized potatoes. They do not have a peeling like those grown in the ground. There are other ways to grow potatoes in a small area. Lay down potatoes. Cover with soil and skirt with scrap wood formed into a square. Lay down another layer of potatoes…repeat as long as you have wood to frame with..The vines will grow out through the openings in the “pig pen” When you want potatoes, simply remove the top layer of soil and the top layer of framing. Leave the other layers until needed. You avoid having to store the potatoes. This probably would not work in the North.
My next project will be to make elderberry,grape jelly and grape juice.
kycreeker
Here’s an article from the UK (though it may well apply to the US as well) about how the heat wave is affecting availablity of fresh vegetables and fruits (and may affect prices for frozen produce as well).
Green Mom - Congratulations on getting the homeschooling up and running! What a major task! Although bf was not your motivation for homeschooling, it is great that now you will not have to worry about when to ‘pull them out’. Also, you’re 10 steps ahead of those of us (me) who will need to plan sip coursework after a school closure. I will need to play catch up by building coursework from wherever they leave off in school. Your kids will have no interruption or readjustment phase to endure. Well done.
They ate the sweetened cereal! Had it hidden away in large bin in cellar, but it was found a devoured. Probably because its a rare treat our household usually doesn’t see…and may not see again for a long time! Repackaging flour and sugars this weekend. Loving vacuum sealer and even the mylar bags and O2 absorbers. New toys! Buying dehumidifier for basement food preps tonight.
Hairspray also takes off sharpie..use it all the time at school to erase sharpie on laminated surface
I posted this last night in the ‘Winter Heat’ thread but it may really belong here. (Plus a reply to fellow Mainer, Lisa.)
> In searching around for thermal shades I came across this article from The Mother Earth News magazine with directions for sewing three types. The shades would make such a great difference on those cold cold nights esp. if I’m SIP and concerned about folks looking in. Scary thought! I also really like the idea of a “draft- and moisture stopping vapor barrier” between the layers of fabric. Here it is >>> http://tinyurl.com/73hw6.
Thanks Bird-dog.
Bird-dog - read your post in winter heat. Sorry (really, really sorry) about the root canal. You actually should take the prescribed antibiotic post procedure as infection a definite painful possibility…but I understand your wanting to keep it. I’m looking for a US army study done on efficacy and toxicity of expired meds. I used to have the study but can’t find it right now. In it, they examined and used meds years out of date with no ill effects and no loss of potency, even sulfa drugs like Bactrim, and the antibiotic ampicillin which has a ‘goes bad’ reputation. Some of the meds used were 10 years out of date! Seems as though many meds have the shelf life of twinkies… I’m going to NIH and Medscape to see if I can find it again and I’ll post it, so you can have some reassurance about those old pills.
anyone - if your next big prep was either a generator or heatsource (in this case, propane stove), which would you get first? Both big money items…both to perform most valuable functions…
For a northern climate, I’d get a stove. Can you get an 80# propane tank, or are you thinking of 20′s? Will you install the stove or is it a portable?
Lisa in Southern Maine, I’d go for a heatsource as well, unless I lived where the temp’s rarely drop to freezing or below. Electricity you can make do without, but you can only get just so cold before it becomes life-threatening.
Bird dog If you are worried about getting antibiotics, why not get a few bottles of the fish antibiotics online? I used the amoxicillin pills a few months ago for an ear infection and it worked great. No doctor, no prescription. It was very cheap and is pharmaceutical grade just like regular scripts. I looked up the dosage online. Obviously only use when you know what you have and how to treat it. Most mothers have the knowledge for all the normal stuff. Just a thought.
Jane - I think I can gett a 200gal propane tank and then have a line run to the stove. Would have to have professional installation. Plan to run generator off tank too, if pos. Sounds like stove will be next, and generator late fall if there is still time and/or $. Do you have a propane stove Jane? What’s your experience, positive or negative?
Kim - succinct and direct. Can’t argue with that kind of logic. Question answered. Thanks!
StLucie - I bought some fish antibiotics in case shtf but I couldn’t find (surely didn’t look hard enough!) validation of them being human consumption safe. I’m glad to hear of your experience with them. Do you know where I can get any documentation on them?
I’m allergic to anything icillin.
Just bought another tarp, more water, more propane, more canned milk. canning jars with extra lids, I ordered wheat yesterday, bought more cat food. I also got my daughter an mp3 today, will run for 19 hours on 1AA battery and has a radio on it too. She put over a hundred song on it in less then a half hour, she is really happy at the moment and it will save me countless batteries, those cd players soak up a lot of energy.
I think I’ll go to sams tomorrow, I have this urge to get more preping done, but my house is a mess.
mp3 is a great idea. I wonder if I can budget one in this month for the kids…or would they each have to have their own in order for any peace to be had in the household…I avoided both prepping and cleaning today by walking and grooming the dogs. Yay! But I’ll pay for this avoidance tomorrow!
We got the mp3 at walmart, was a pretty good deal. She uses limewire/free and legal to download the music. Will save money on cd’s too at an average 10 bucks a pop or more. My son bought his there too for $40, not the best but it does the job.
KimT - thanks. if I keep ‘adding’ afforadable items to prep I won’t be able to afford a bankruptcy lawyer :). This does seem necessary though…an adolescant peacekeeping device. Priceless!
Here’s the USDA Nutrition Site.
Lisa in Southern Maine – at 23:34 Hi Lisa, I did some reading on fish antibiotics awhile back and I learned that the ingredients are exactly the same as human grade and are regulated by the FDA the same way human drugs are. I will try to find a link for you. I took some fish antibiotics myself and they worked, for what its worth.
knowall - each positive experience I hear with the fish antibiotics makes me more calmn about possibly having to use them. So…it’s worth a lot to get your input. Thanks.
I am clueless about fish antibiotics……I pulled up petcarerx.com and the price was really cheap 100 for about 15.00…anyway, I guess what I would like to know is I realize that fish and people are different….duh….but for a single dose what would an adult take???
Oh Bronco Bill said earlier: Y’all can find Part XII ovah heah! (Ah’m practicin’ tahkin’ Suthurn…)
Chile, you’ve earned an A+ on Suthurn! Bless yur littl’ heart!
been working the dehydrator overtime! Grilled, and then dehydrated some marinated chicken breasts (about three pounds) that were strongly flavored—too much straight from the grill, but cut up and dried turned out great—I threw some into a chicken tortilla soup, and definitely kicked it up a notch. BAM I also overhauled all the dry preps today. Everything was out on the floor (on a tarp of course) and I washed, dried and left out in the sun all the containers—there was a little odd odor—maybe outgassing from the plastic—but now, all is neutral. Repacked everything, threw in some bay leaves that I bought in the Hispanic section of safeway—so much cheeper than the spice section!---, and back out to the garage with it. Sounds easy, but much harder than it looked; just ask my back!
Houston 6-pack
That is where simple math comes in. Don’t go by the pill. Look at the mg per pill. Find a good reference for antibiotic dosage, maybe the Physicians desk reference, and do the math.
I highly, highly suggest only using the fish antibiotics in the case of an emergency where it is impossible to see a doctor. I worry about the prior poster who self dosed her/himself for an ear infection. The majority of ear infections usually turn out to be viral in nature, and run their course and go away, with or without antibiotics. Taking antiobiotics in the case of a viral infection would be at the very least a waste of antibiotics, or more worrisome, contributing to the overuse of antibtiotics and risking culturing an antibiotic strain of bacteria within the user
Billie tonight~~
You know, I think I’m going to skip the whole fish antibiotics. Thank you for your input….it would be a wast of antibiotics……
The whole fish antibiotics thing is complex. Yes, I do have the full complement, but I work in health care, so I have a little understanding of the different meds. I also have a Merck Manual, a Washington Manual of Medical Therapeutics and a Physician’s Desk Reference. All well and good, but there are times when I say “we gotta call the doc”, and know full well if something goes south, I have no one but myself to blame. FA are for emergencies only. This is from soemeone who spent way too much time in the ER after suffering a severe allergic reaction (anaphylaxis) after taking her husband’s Levaquin. This sh*t can kill you!!!
‘nuff said
Jefiner- Houston 6-pack
I too have some fish antibiotics, primarily for my animals, but I would use them on myself under the following cirumstances- 1.- I could talk to a doctor who’d advise me to take antibiotics 2.- I couldn’t get antibiotics from a pharmacy 3.- I told the doctor what I had and he said it was better than not.
Lisa in S. Maine (I’m in MA…not to far) and others about antibiotics aging/going bad.
In nursing school I remember there is ONE antibiotic that goes bad and becomes TOXIC, and that the rest of them just fade away in terms of efficacy, ie if they are TOO old, they don’t work as well or eventially at all. I remember that very few drugs turn into something toxic if they are older than the expiration date.
Can a healthcare person, pharmacist, MD, nurse etc confirm which one that is? it’s a common antibiotic. Don’t want to mention the one I think because the name might stick wrongly in peoples brains!;) (I didn’t finish nursing school;))
I agree with the posters that it is smart to TRY to avoid taking something you haven’t taken before (allergic rxn etc). If you are going to get fish antibiotics (or some other way…I had an infected toe, got erythromycin, and by the time I filled it the infection was gone so didn’t take it-added to preps), it probably is best to learn the correct dose, indications, side effects, etc—info that would be in a good drug book, a nursing book would work. Perhaps that’s obvious, I just feel the urge to mention prepping Knowledge-wise whenever people talk about prepping meds.
I was psyched to get the erythromycin. I admit to also ordering from a foreign online pharmacy amoxicillin (or was it Augmentin?)when I got my Tamiflu (?, because who knows if it’s real!) because Where THere Is NO Doctor (search online, it’s free manual) suggests that is most useful antibiotic overall. And I have had it before and know I am not allergic. I also have plenty of Benadryl which may help in case of allergy…as well as rashes…as well as seasonal allergies…as well as sleep…etc etc..
I haven’t had any kind of bacterial infection that I know of since I was a child more than thirty years ago. I find that comforting, and it reminds me that people that TEND to get certain types of infections periodically might be stuck. For example, a friend tends to get bladder infections, maybe she should be sure to store cranberry juice which can cure bladder infections (before they get to your kidneys and become something serious). IT’s great because it’s available in those soft boxes that are dated over a year away.
I am thinking how useful having yoghurt will be. I am lactose intolerant but can eat youghurt it’ll be a great source of calcium and protein, as WELL as great to take as many know when you have to take antibiotics or when recovering from stomach/intestinal problems. (restores the good bacteria in your gut, which antibiotics can kill). Also will be great for the kids that (pray it doesn’t happen) I might have to take in if it gets very bad. I made it from fresh milk this spring, flavored it with stored maple syrup, or honey, or stored fruit-only jam. Yummy sweet treat! I need to see if I can make it with dry powdered milk. I did an experiment and it kept fine overnight at room temperature (70 degrees) for 24 hours. iI think one of my last minute supermarket buys will be a container of plain yoghurt to use as starter if TSHTF. I think under most conditions I could keep a constant “culture’ of yoghurt to always have..at least for the cool part of the year hear in the Northeast.it needs to “incubate” in a warm place, that needs experimentation as currently i put it in cool oven with pilot light…maybe some candle-thing will work.
I ramble on, just some ideas I think Billie tonight’s post on circumstances to take prepped antibiotics, unless you are healthcare trained, are a good guide for all of us. With the caveat, at least in my mind, that if you could NOT reach a doctor, you would have printed out WHERE THERE IS NO DOCTOR or some other knowledge base, and the person was very ill and getting worse, I’d take it. Well, I am confident enough myself to do it in other cirucumstances, but I consider self healthcare trained enough like Jenifiner described for self.
AVanarts, Eccles: I worked in labs for years also! We used Isopropanol to remove sharpie ink almost continuously…on tubes, glasswear, etc. I am under impression Acetone is more toxic than isopropanol. Sharpies are great. ..I got a bunch of them and put them everywhere in my preps of ease of finding…even put one in my bug out bag so I can write signs etc (such as “KEEP AWAY…INFECTED WITH FLU”)
hope all of you affected by by the heatwave are keeping cool. It is 86 degrees in my living room (sigh)
wow this ended up being a long post! sorry! alot on my mind, «<off topic»feeling alot of things are going increasingly bad in the world economically, politically, environmentally etc. THinking about my preps alot and that they are so multi purpose and give me comfort to have increasingly given this «end off topic»
Back there in pharmacy school, I was taught that tetracycline is the one drug that should never be taken after the expiration date. The risk is severe kidney damage from one of the breakdown products as it degrades. I believe I may have read something lately that even this may not be true, but personally, since I can’t confirm it, I would advise anyone to throw away any outdated or visibly deteriorating tetracycline that might be hanging around.
Apharmacist: Phew! Thanks so much. Thats what I remembered too..doxycycline, which is same family. so folks, TOSS (better, FLUSH or wash down drain…so dogs, kids have no chance of getting it…thats what they say to do to old meds) the old tetracyline or doxycycline. If you have any current, maybe you’d want to circle the expiration date and write (with your Sharpie!) “toxic if expired” on it.
we have enough threats to our lives upcoming it seems.
We’ve really been trying NOT to take any antibiotics if we can possibly avoid it, -mostly out of concern of bacteria becoming more resistant due to overuse of antibiotics. Husband is allergic to “icillians” anyway. He used to get really nasty sinus infections-we’ve found that a morning flushing of the sinus passages with salt water has almost elimanated the infections! Many conditions for which an antibiotic is prescribed turns out to be viral anyway. Ive had weird reactions to meds that were prescribed specifially for me-I would really be nervous about taking someone else’s meds, especially meds prescribed for fish!!!!
I totally understand the appeal of having lots of meds on hand for emergencies-and I do have a pretty awesome first aid kit assembled, but I’m just too chicken to experiment with “extracuricular” antibiotics.
Lisa at 16:05 on homeschooling-
Thanks! I’m kind of surprised how relieved I feel now that the kids are out of school. Thats one prep I feel pretty good about. Ive also have been secretly buying additional fun books, games, puzzles, models kits etc for them- trying to get non-electric, non battery powered entertainment items for teens is a challange! The mp3 that runs on one battery is a great idea! Ive been scouring yard sales, thrift stores, deep discount places like Big Lots.
Now I have to really work on food preps which is the prep area that scares me the most.
Hi everyone, just in case anyone is interested, I am posting this excerpt of an article on fish antibiotics and general use of animal medicines by people. It was posted on the Consumer Health Information website (link is at the bottom). It claims that many fish antibiotics are actually produced by the same companies that produce human antibiotics, and sold under a different name. They are subject to the same FDA regulations. The main risk of using these drugs comes from potential improper storage at the pet store and from people misdiagnosing themselves.
Should You Be “Chicken” About Taking “Horse” Pills?
“The cost of prescription drugs is hard for many Americans to swallow. Many people have found a different way to treat themselves in their local pet store. Along these aisles, bottles of fish antibiotics line the shelves. Is this the best way to treat your illness? Are medicines that you would give your fish safe for you to take?
Many people think that the drugs for pets are not as high quality as those for people. However, this is not true. The requirements by the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) for animal and human drugs are the same. They do inspections of the manufacturing process to be sure that animal medicines are safe and high quality. Many companies that make animal medicines also make the same product for humans but sell it with a different name.
On the other hand, the storage of these products may not be as well monitored at a pet or feed store as in your local pharmacy. Expiration dates are checked regularly in a pharmacy. The pet store does not have medical staff that are concerned about the medicine’s quality. The expiration dates may not be as thoroughly checked. If a drug product expires and is taken, you may have more side effects or the medicine may not work as well.”
full article at http://www.consumer-health.com/services/cons_take30.htm
JP Planner - in nursing school the percieved offender was tetracyclines. This was based on one MDs experience of a patient getting violently ill after taking the expired tetracycline and incurring renal tube damage. But no one has been able to prove the meds did it, and it was an isolated case. Still, enough of a caution for me.// I’m still looking for the Dept. of Defense drug expiration study. Have found multiple refernces to it but haven’t located the study itself in it’s entirety (spelling?). Here is a DOD later, briefer write up of the study, and there is a chart of some meds showing potency up to 18 years (pralidoxime) and 15 years (atropine) from manufacture, 13 years potent from expiration date. http://tinyurl.com/mnq6w http://tinyurl.com/h6lo9.
Greenmom - I think we’re all a bit intimidated when we start our food preps. Good luck! I did water, then the ‘farthest out’ food, such as the huge buckets of grains, potatoes, freezedried fruits/veggies and meats, milks..Then I moved to midrange foods, canned goods mostly, meats/fruits/veggies, bouillions, etc…Now I’m on short termers - freezer meats and veggies, milks, flatbreads, etc… With long-term foods, the farthest out group, I bought bulk spices too. Week by week, it’s reassuring to see progress. Careful not to get overwhelmed. Notice the progress you make and congratulate yourself on what you achieve!
knowall - thanks for the fish abt. article. Looksa like the caution is right med/doseage for diagnosis, not a concern about human consumption.
jplanner - sorry for spelling your name wrong in previous reply. Your yogurt sounds so yummy. Please tell me how it goes when you make it with the evaporated milk.
I spent my lunch hour at Aldi’s buying canned goods for our church pantry. I had $115 from the various offerings and contributions and was able to purchase the following:
I really enjoyed doing this shopping, and even more enjoyed the sight of all of those canned goods stacked in our church pantry.
I’m not quite sure where to stick this, but I’ll try here. This is an article warning about potential problems using high strength Hydrogen Peroxide, which I know some on Fluwikie have espoused for use in water purification:
FDA Warns Against Internal Use of High-Strength Hydrogen Peroxide uly 28, 2006 — The US Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has issued a health advisory to warn consumers against the purchase and ingestion of high-strength hydrogen peroxide products for medicinal purposes due to the risk for serious harm or death.
Consumers are advised to immediately discontinue use of these products, which include currently marketed items such as “35 Percent Food Grade Hydrogen Peroxide,” and consult their healthcare provider, according to an alert sent yesterday from MedWatch, the FDA’s safety information and adverse event reporting program.
The high-strength hydrogen peroxide products are more than 10 times more concentrated than topical products used for disinfecting minor cuts. Ingestion of these highly corrosive products can cause gastrointestinal irritation or ulceration, and intravenous administration can result in blood vessel inflammation at the injection site, gas embolisms, and potentially life-threatening allergic reactions.
I found this on Medscape. I have a subscription, so I’m not sure whether the page can be read by non-subscribers.
Closed for length, but continued in it’s entirety here.
Eccles – at 13:55 copied to new thread. Link does require a subscription.