I know this has been discussed in many other threads, but I wanted a specific thread on this—I’m in my 20′s as are most of the people I know. Sometimes it feels as if we’ve been written off in this matter. I know many people here are 40+, what advice do you, or anyone else for that matter, have for those most at risk?
I am 42. My husband, and all my children are in your age group. Please dont think we have written you off. Most of the prepping I do is *because* most everyone I care about is in that age range. If you have a parent or older relative who is open to it, might i suggest you speak to him/her about your worries and maybe set something up there? I intend to be the caregiver and system person for my family, so the ones at more risk because of age can “hide behind me” as it were and stay as much out of harms way as possible. Also, if one of them gets sick and needs nursing it makes most sense that i do it. Not only because of experience, but if someone in the family needs to die from catching it from another, then i feel thats best be me rather than the younger ones that still have children and marriage etc to look forward to. I think many other middle aged (!!!) folk may feel the same?
I have a 25 year old son who lives about 2 hrs. away - I don’t think he is really tuned in to all this but I am including him into our quarantine - I hope he will be able to break away if the time comes. I send him pertinent post on BF but I try not to overload him with all the junk out there.
anonymous youth, no darling you are most certainly not being written off. We worked very hard and sacrificed much to bring our babies to the beginning of their adult lives. We don’t want to see that come crashing to an untimely end. Woodstock is right, we’re prepping for our families, not for ourselves.
On the 40+ side of the fence, we’re having a very difficult time convincing our children this is a serious situation. What convinced you that you need to prepare for a catastrophic pandemic?
flourbug—I am only 22, and am totally convinced that I need to prepare. IMO, it’s rather silly not to. I happen to catch maybe 2 minutes of Good Morning America awhile back and they were talking about BF, and how people should have 10 days worth of food and water (haha, right??) Anyways, I got on the ‘net to look into it, and found places like this one….no more convincing needed. I have kids to protect, and I intend on me and them sticking around. BF or not. Besides that, it just makes sense to prepare for ANYTHING that might happen!
I’m in my twenties. I’m the only one I know prepping. If I was focusing on things the way I should I have a ton of studying to be doing, but this keeps coming up. Prepping also gives me something else to focus on:) My parents are starting to slowly catch on though. They have begun to talk about BF with co-workers.
Before learning more about the details of the BF, which I started into about this past January, I was already thinking in terms of survival anyway. I think it is good to know how to be prepared in any kind of situation, urban or rural or wild. So I had already begun researching survival literature. It is true that it is mostly an attitude. It is the will to life, not death. Not fatalism.
I have three kids, all young adults in their early 20s. Everything I do with regards to prepping is with the hope they will be strong enough to survive this. As parents my DH and I are making plans for them to help them handle things should we not survive this. We are trying to make sure all our families life and health insurance is up to par, doing things like advanced funeral planning, setting things up so they know who gets what and which relatives to contact that might be able to help guide them. We are also spending time with them, letting them know how important prepping is and how important they are to us. I am so glad they are listening.
I sincerely hope this will not turn out like 1918–1919 during which so many younger people died. I would much rather it be me than them. Personally I am going to do everything within my power to see to it that we all come through this alive and well. I urge you to talk with your family about pandemic flu and about prepping. Let them know your concerns. They may be glad you are mature enough to care about this.
anonymous youth: I have a daughter your age who lives halfway across the country. She had a full tank of gas, extra cash, and stuff ready to travel (jerky, clothes, water, etc.) The minute TSHTF, she will head for home, where I am hoping I will be prepared. Still getting it together, due to tardy finances. I, too, am planning to be the care provider for my family, and if someone has to go outside our isolation place, it will be me. For this, I think it’s important to remember to sterilize after going into the “world,” and before re-entering your isolation environment. If you are on your own, I suggest you get some easy to fix food rations and lots of water. As much as you can prepare to stay isolated. Then hunker down and stay put until the first wave is over. After that you may want to contact others in your area or family and change plans—or not. Good luck. Like many here, I have a strong maternal instinct, and if I were Queen of the World, I’d be seeing that all you youngsters were VERY prepared to be isolated.
i have been told that here in australia there will be cordons to stop movement between infected areas. Is that not so in the US? I just worry when people mention loved ones far away heading home when it hits…
I also have 3 children in their 20′s and a grandchild. All my prepping is for them. After 9–11, we all sat down and made plans for what to do if terrorists struck here, you know, who to call and where to go. It made us feel better and even though this is quite a different kind of plan, we have a plan in place if we are quarantined. I think it helps them go on with a normal life and that is what I want for them to do. I have always been the worrier and it’s a burden I gladly accept. If the time comes, God forbid, they know what to do. I suggest everyone sit down with their grown children and talk to them, tell them even though it may never happen, here’s the plan… I think they listen to us a lot more than we give them credit for.
With what’s going on, thought I’d ask again.
this isn’t about what 20-somethings should do, per se, but it does suggest that they’re not totally being forgotten…
check out
Emanuel EJ, Wertheimer A. Who should get influenza vaccine when not all can? Science. 2006 May 12;312(5775):854–5.
or if you don’t have access to article, the press talk on it covers much of it
— see this
http://mmrs.fema.gov/news/influenza/2006/may/nflu2006-05-12.aspx
(also, btw - the 1918 pandemic age pattern was _not_ a W… I think an old Osterholm figure on FW shows this (but doesn’t say it). And the Emanuel & Wertheimer piece also discusses this… in 1918 the elderly were actually better off than they were in preceding and subsequent normal interpandemic flu epidemics. Go figure…)
Hey anonymous youth
I’m towards the upper end of the 20–40 year old group so if it’s like the 1918 pandemic, we’ll be in this together.
First things first: Take a good deep breath and try to relax a little.
Now on to preparations. The wiki side of this site is collecting excellent guides on how to get ready. You will learn about everything from how to practice good hand hygiene (which is a pretty simple rule to carefully wash your hands more, and it’s a good habit to get into) to what kinds of things you will want to have on hand in the heat of a pandemic crisis to adjustment reactions (I suspect we’re all having one now because the authorities out there are acknowledging a lot of what we’ve suspected for the last several days and what has happened to the Karo cluster family in Indonesia is upsetting).
It would be a good idea to read through and print out those guides because they will give you some perspective and some ideas on what you will need to prepare yourself.
I would give first priority to having a stash of water, some over the counter medicines (most of which you would have on hand to fight ordinary cold & flu symptoms), some food which you like, is easy to prepare and doesn’t require refrigeration, and toilet paper and toiletries. You can get to the rest as you better educate yourself.
Anybody else have some sage advice for anonymous youth?
I’m 41, I keep after my son who just turned 20 yesterday…he smirks at me, my nephew stopped by last night he is 20 also, I asked him about the BF and he said he wasn’t paying attention. I made him promise to do his own research. Today I went to my daughters 8th grade graduation. 210 kids. wow. I looked at these young faces, many I have known since pre-school and I had to bite my lips to keep from crying, I’m crying now thinking about them. I hope and pray that TPTB get their s—t together and stop this from happening. I’ve struggled to keep my kids alive for years, they both almost died on me and I had one daughter who did. I fear for our young people. I would gladly sacrafice myself for them and should they be taken from me then there will no longer be reason for me to exsist. If you know away to let young people become aware, yell it from the roof tops!
Bumped for visibility
If you can find no other reason in your heart to put aside some preps for ‘dumb’ neighbours who didn’t heed the warnings, Kim gives us all the answer. Assuming they are not addicts or psychopaths, whatever you can give them they’ll probably give to their children, especially the little ones who had no way of knowing and are otherwise helpless.
I have no children nor did I ever plan to, but if any of my neighbours kids came to me I couldn’t turn them away, I’d figure it out. I’d even sleep in my shed if contagion was an issue. There comes a point where fear of a virus is overcome by human compassion. Once the initial shock is done with I think we’ll surprise ourselves.
Anonymous Youth: As you probably know, the 1918 pandemic hit people in the age group of less than 40 particularly hard, due probably to the fact that this age group may not have had existing antibodies to H1N1 and the fact that they probably suffered a cytokine storm, due to their robust immune systems.
There appears to me to be somewhat of a misunderstanding that people above 40 are going to be less affected by any new influenza. Given that most of our immune systems haven’t seen H5N1 before, I consider myself (I’m 42) as likely as someone younger to be susceptible to suffering severe consequences of being infected. It may also be that our general improved health of those around in 1918 will mean that the immune systems of the over 40s will also cause a cytokine storm - we just don’t know.
I know many people in your age group and have attempted to discuss the BF with them. Not surprisingly, all have been dismissive. For me, I think having children (mine are 7 and 5) forces a parent to sit up and take notice. The fact that you are aware of the possibility is your greatest asset. Absorb as much as you can from the knowledge available here, you never know what knowledge may be important.
I am 58 my wife is Sixty. We have spent a good deal of money to be ready to support 10 people for 6 months. I do not include myself in that number, I will have to work so I will stay out of the house and take my chances while I resupply them. My wife will be the primary care giver for any of the kids or grand kids that get sick. In short your age group has not been forgotten. I can only hope some one has your back the way I have my kids. (By the way they all think I am nuts and have talked about a home for their mother and I)
Bump
Advice for today’s youth: Plan to get your annual flu shot next season and also get a pneumonia vaccine. The pneumonia vaccine may save your life during a Cytokine Storm (most likely to happen in bird flu sufferes in this age group). Getting a flu shot next season will help to distinguish, should you become ill, if you caught the regular flu or the bird flu. It will also prevent you from getting both at the same time or close in time. You don’t want to get the regular flu and two weeks later get the bird flu. Certain recipe for disaster.
I also think that kids and young adults in this age group (my sons are 25 and 20) tend to “share” things….sodas, food, cigarettes - you name it. Practice getting out of this habit. Practice using a disposable cup when at a friend’s house or out and about and don’t allow others to drink from it. Also practice extensive handwashing - something all of us need to practice more of.
Shows what I know, didn’t even know you could get a pneumonia vaccine. How can you get one?
Even a womans habit of putting her purse on the ground,(we all do it) gets everykind of bacterian, e-coli, staph and so on, then you put it on your kitchen counter, and possibly make a sandwhich on that spot, then eat. I know I always allowed someone with me to snack off my plate, or even if they were close, eat from my fingers. From my mouth to your ears, change your habits, and be suprised how hard it is. If you are in an intimate relationship fine, casual or even old time friends, forget it.
Janet,
Your advice is not bad, these are reasonable precautions to take, but not for the reason you state. Cytokine storm is acute respiratory distress syndrom and the pneaumovax has no effect on it. Secondary pneumonaccocal infections are always a danger with the flu, and the vax offers some protection.
Advice for today’s youth: Plan to get your annual flu shot next season and also get a pneumonia vaccine.
Good luck with that. Around here (Massachusetts), flu clincs are for people 65+ only. Those with health problems or compromised immune systems can get them at a doctor’s office, as can infants and kids (maybe just small kids). This year in Massachusetts adults under 65 probably could have got them at a doctor’s office…maybe. The year before with the flu vaccine screwup, forget about it. Then at the end of February, after the flu season had mostly run its course, they said, “Hey, we got all this vaccine we didn’t use! Anyone want some?” I had flu and whooping cough both that year, and was working outdoors all winter. It was a treat, let me tell you.
My understanding is that neither 10 nor 40 is the cutoff; the Health and Human Services “high priority groups” are:
IOW, don’t start thinking that those of us over 40 are getting the shots. We’re in the same boat you are.
lbb - while I haven’t gotten mine PPV23 yet, my understanding from many on this site and other places is that many walk-in clinics (not state run but for-profit) can give you a vaccine. 10–40 is a concern primarily because 1)20–40 was the highest fatality rates in 1918 and 2) most of the deaths from H5N1 have been those under 40. However, if it goes H2H there really is no telling who will be most at risk. The HHS list is the list they use for the regular seasonal flu. As someone said before - PPV23 is a chink in the armor in fighting AF. It’s worth trying a few more places before giving up.
bump
How can young people help? Someone suggested creating a hip-hop song, or a video-contest of some sort. People on http://www.spreadfirefox.com sure have ideas on how to gather people around issues. Make prevention and prepping viral? Take the future on your own hands? Start a business making fashion washable masks? Write a blog with your own unique perspective? http://www.blogger.com or wherever
Could we have a blog by two people, one an oldie and the other a youngster, so that they have an open conversation around this and other topics?
hmm. the relative lack of responses = not encouraging.
Thanks to the bumpers, though.
anonymous youth, you can try to get a pneumo vax from a local walk-in clinic. If they ask why you could try telling them that you developed pneumonia last time you got the flu and you don’t want it to happen again. I don’t know what they would cost in your area, but if you could get one it’s a little extra protective measure. You might have better luck now that the flu season isn’t in full swing here in N.America.
Check out the prepping threads. Try to have at least a few weeks of food and water on hand, 3 months would be better. Basically, the advice for you is the same as for anybody- plan and prepare to be able to be self-sufficient in terms of basic essentials(food, water, maintenance meds)for a few months so you can isolate and avoid others for a time. Also so you don’t suffer deprivation from the supply-chain break down that is likely to occur.
Other specific advice would depend on your individual situation.
My 19 year old son went this weekend for the pneumonia shot. I went with him. They asked me why and I stated that I do alot of international travel (the truth) and that I was very concerned about dragging home the avian flu. They said fine and gave him the vaccine. My husband got one also. Now, I just have to get my oldest son in and then we will have all received the vaccine. I feel so much better having everyone vaccinated.
All of us had the flu shot last year (including the two boys) and all of us will have it next year. Not sure what to advise those folks whose states won’t give it to them unless they are high risk. That is a shame. Is there anywhere else you can go for it? Out of state?
I know that the current flu vaccine won’t help against an avian flu, but it is sure nice to know that we won’t get the regular flu on top of the avian. It also helps to know that if someone comes down with the flu during a pandemic, you can almost be sure that it is the “real thing” if you have had your seasonal vaccine.
Again, I feel a huge sense of relief knowing that my family is somewhat protected for a secondary infection. It just may help….that is all I can ask for.
Janet,
The annual flu vaccines are 60–90% effective. Get the shot but don’t count on not getting sick.
Hi Melanie. I’ll take those odds - though 100 percent would be better!
I have the flu shot every year because I am high risk. It got me thinking the other day that I have never had the flu, even though I am 51 year old…never. Not sure if the flu shots have just been effective enough or if I have a really good resistance.
I travel alot on planes and would have just figured that I would have been exposed to it more than most. To the best of my knowledge, no one in my family has had the flu in many, many years. I think my older brother had it in college some 40 years ago, but that has been it.
I think of the flu as something that knocks you for a loop and keeps you in bed for three days to a week. I certainly have had my colds and stomach viruses, but nothing like that.
Again, don’t know if it is the vaccines or if some people are more or less likely to catch it.
anonymous youth What do you want to do? Have you been reading the forum? You asked in March what advice for those most at risk. Well were all at risk, what have you done since March?
I’m not sure if I found the wiki in February or March but since then, I have been learning a lot. I occasionaly jump in on a discusion but generally stay quiet because my talents are not in electricity or medicine and there seems to be enough experts here on natual healthcare; my old profession and not sure what I can offer as a sales person and copywriter.
I am pleased to report, finally a few people I have talked with are now taking me serious and have begun prepping, not as many as I would like but…
We each have our own issues to deal with, young-old,health issues, money problems, lack of space, overwhelming fear… but we that are here have several things in common.
Awareness. The desire to survive against the odds. The ability to overcome the overwheling fear that is staring at us and a twisted sense of humor, oh and let us not forget, compassion and empathy for others.
The best answers are here. If you haven’t started to prep, do so now. Start or continue talking with your peers to help them to prepare. You may experiance what most of us here have experianced, our right denial, people ignoring you and even laughter. Just do what you can.
It is our responsibiliy because we are the ones who have the awareness. This seems to be a grassroots campaign to inform the masses. Just begin.
Anon youth: I was thinking about your question and I just wanted to let you know how impressed I often am with the real comraderie that today’s youth has with one another. I have heard it described as “tribes” where you all form a very tight-knit group, not based on same sex or romantic partnerships. Just based on friendship and caring and helping one another.
With this type of bond, I would guess that there is so much you all could do for one another not only during the pandemic, but beforehand.
Is your concern of the flu something you could share with your friend and maybe get a support team together around this concern? Maybe you could prep together or at least discuss it so that you don’t feel so isolated with your concern. Maybe, as a group, you could volunteer at a shelter or foodbank to make you feel more “empowered”, because that is that is what you are…the youth of today is empowered and strong and will hopefully join all of us in meeting this potential deadly threat head on and getting through it together.
Sorry if I sounded hostile—there are issues with prepping itself, (i.e. space, money), but those are addressed elsewhere; what I meant originally was in reaction to reading countless posts that mentioned the ARDS/cytokine storm in young adults, which lead to fear, which lead to frustration. Similar to someone’s post a while ago…this person said that he/she lived in a densely populated urban area, but refused to be written off as “collateral damage.” (As in, “well naturally a lot of {enter group} will die.”) And also mentioned in another thread, maybe “what things will be like after,” or a similar title, there was a post that mentioned that naturally there was going to be a dearth in the workforce due to young adults being dead, and reading it (as a youth) you’re just kind of at a loss as to what to do. But basically what concerned me in particular was the unique medical situation mentioned above—and half-jokingly thinking I should sabotage my immune system led me to seek advice: Is there anything that can be done to stave that off, or is it pretty much out our hands? Or was it a misconception that the majority of those killed in the 1918 pandemic were young?
I think its pretty much out of our hands. There are threads that talk about the use of benadryl, prednisone, other meds and natuaral herbs…that MAY help but no one really knows for sure.
The best options seem to shelter in place (SIP) prep for as long as you can until progress is eventually made on vaccines.
The reality of that…I don’t know. I’m prepping. I have benadryl and other suggested options, I don’t know if it will make a difference but i’m gonna do my best.
Will my mortgage company be understanding if my office closes down and I can’t make payments. Again I don’t know, that has also been discussed in a financial thread.
I don’t have a lot of options. I am now a single parent with one income, will I be forced by circumstances to leave my shelter to work and what will i do with my 14 year old daughter she can’t stay home alone 24/7 and her dad has asthma, epilepy and Guillin Barre, he almost died this year with another bout of pneumia, could he survice the avian flu?
Hard facts and I don’t like them very much. But I wont quit and neither should you and your friends.
Someone has to continue to run the businesses that are needed, someone needs to_______.
We are, each of us looking at our own mortality and I suspect thats why I have been sleeping alot on the weekends as an escape and why after my daughter left the other night for several hours that I allowed my self the opportunity to cry before I picked myself back up and got back to work.
There are no absolute answers and no guarentees, never has been and the control we all imagine we have over our one lives is just an illusian. I found that out the hard way a few years back. What do we have control of is how we deal with what comes our way.
Do we give up & dig our own graves and jump in, or do we fight with dignity, honor, respect and give our very best for ourselves, family and humanity in general? I’m gonna fight.
KimT - Well said. Some days it seems almost useless, but I remember in Stephen King’s super-flu horror story “The Stand” almost 30 years ago the last words of the matriarch Mother Abigail were to “Stand!” to the survivors. The test was not in just surviving the pandemic, but in having the courage to continue in the world with a sense of moral once the pestilence had passed. I have taken that single word to heart since I finally had my cry the other day - after watching my son play the lead in his 3rd grade play, scared that I may never see him live to grow up. Somewhere, somehow we must make our “Stand” against the “beast” that this flu and its aftermath may bring. To not try is to already be dead.
Tray75: Life ALWAYS trumps death if you live each day to its fullest. I know this sounds trite, but love and act towards your child today like the pandemic is going to hit tomorrow. Then, pray that it never does. It is not just the pandemic that is a threat to a mother or a child … it could be an accident, cancer, heart attack, illness - you name it. The pandemic is no more of a fear than any of these other things yet the pandemic is something you can prepare for in small ways.
You have an excellent chance of watching you son grow up and have children of his own. The pandemic will kill many as will cancer and accidents, but we all have an excellent chance of living to a ripe old age. Just make each day the absolute fullest that it can be and life will then be so rewarding. So many people live a long life but never know how blessed they are. It sounds like you live it to the fullest and want to enjoy your son for many decades.
Again, there is a very, very good chance that you will so, get prepared for any and all threats and live, love and laugh like you don’t have a care in the world. That is what I am trying to do - it is hard because I am so afraid for my kids, but it is possible and is often contagious!!!!
“The median age of victims with confirmed cases was 20 years, the report said. The highest death rate — 73 percent — was among patients ages 10 to 19, while the overall fatality rate was 56 percent. This pattern has been noted before, but the new analysis takes in more cases; the typical age is drifting downward.”
STAND!!! indeed Tray.
Anonymous Youth…Everyone is doing everything they can to protect everyone, the youth , the old no matter who you are. We are all in this together. I know that parents, grandparents, and others are sincerely trying to protect all the young people from harm. We need to prep, use precautions hand cleaning regularly, social distancing when the pandemic occurs . And take it one step at a time. We must take it one step at a time. So it won’t be overwhelming i think. We love our children and everyones children they are our future.
Anon youth yes, this keeps coming up, but if it’s true what can we do about it other than mount a campaign to stop it from being reported? I am at the higher end of the danger age group and I choose to ignore these statistics. They may be useful for government vaccination strategies but they are meaningless to me as an individual as there’s nothing I can do about it.
Before you are tempted to sabotage your immune system, read the Cytokine Storm threads, taking note of what NS1 has to say. There is a lot you can do to enhance and protect your health without having to rely on big pharma to come up with a magic bullet.
Here in my town in Massachusetts, pneumonia shots are available free from the public health nurse in my town. There was a recent article that said that getting the shot seems to reduce the chance of getting VIRAL pneumonia by about a third, do not know why, further research on that claim would seem to be in order, but all that I talk to about the Pandemic, the one thing I try to get across is that the single best thing they can do is to get that shot.
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