Has anyone read anything about if the government would step in to put a halt to bill collection during a pandemic? We work on 100% commission in face-to-face sales. If BF hits, there is no way for us to work from home, so we would have to quit. We would actually want to quit early because some of our customers come in from out of state, so we would be exposed even if there wasn’t an actual “wave” in our area yet. This means we would not only lose all of our income, but health insurance as well. I’m wondering how all of this would play out. Would we lose everything to foreclosure, collections, etc? Would the hospitals be able to turn us away with no ins. coverage?
without any intended snark,you could be pretty well screwed. could you prepay or cobra insurance? could you set up some type of annuity? this is exactly why the mere possibility of a pandemic wigs people out. no one knows the answers to these questions.
I know a partial answer… if the gov’t declares a “disaster area” -which they do in emergencies after hurricanes, tornados & such, then all the bills are essentially “put on hold”. Your creditors can’t apply interest and can’t demand payment for a set time… usually you get a grace period of 6 months - even if the bill originates out of state. Mortgage payments usually get differed to the end of the loan period, but you would have to apply for that. One reason shown on the forms for deferral to be granted is “that a disaster area has been declared in the county of residence.” Local “rent” may be different. Some landlords could say that since you were able to occupy the household, you should pay the mortgage. Some may allow the rent “owed” to be prorated. it probably depends whether the landlord owns the property outright or has a mortgage on it. If they can get the mortgage holder to allow payments to be skipped, they they would probably extend that to you, but you may have to pay a fee for each month skipped (to account for any additional interest they end up paying down the road). If they own it outright, they have more ability to make decisions on their own. I would look into any web publications post hurricane Andrew to see what legal precedents were set regarding renters’ rights.
I have given a lot of thought to that and I have a feeling there won’t be much of a problem about “bill collection” during forced quarantine during waves.
Foremost, most bill collection requires a call center to collect and process debts and payments. Call centers will HAVE to shut down because having 200 or more people in Dilbert Ville cubes talking on the phone will kill about 40% of the people working there and disable another 25% from complications if they survive being sick. The financial world basically will have to stop, as will credit reporting and collections, to avoid killing their staff.
I’d consider it a small “gift from God” situation because everyone - rich, middle-income, poor, and destitute - will be equal for the duration. The phones and power may be out for extended periods. Civil unrest may make going to work too dangerous to attempt. Employers and creditors that don’t take this into account may find themselves bankrupt by legal liabilities if they try to force people out to work or pay during such a crisis, and I’d not expect to find a jury of survivors sympathetic in the least if the case went to trial.
If the pandemic hits, and we all end up bankrupt, the banks will have to revise the entire credit structure or go out of business, because no substantial section of society will be without major blemishes due to no income and no expenditures for up to 3 months. A lot of real estate and property may be available as estates, but ownership means nothing if mortgage lenders and banks can’t resell the property to credit damaged consumers. It becomes a drain on their balance sheets that will bankrupt them if they don’t adjust. All IMHO, but read some of the business impact and economic paper in the wiki for more.
So, do your preps, hope you never have to use them, and consider your SIP time as time you were given to reflect upon what really matters to you in life and live every minute of it in case it does turn out to be your last.
My landlord will be paid by cheques shoved under my front door. Let him go to the bank, not me. The stash of brand new clean cash bundles in my safe will be used for last minute preps and survival of me and my family.
Save money now to pay your nessasary bills ie mortage/rent and utilities. Ive been saving since last fall now have enough to last two years. I had to forgo somw luxuries, but the peace of mind is well worth it
So many things you aks about are difficult to predict and may vary by area/state depepnding on local laws, how bad things get etc. A hospital in one town may turn you away but not another. Your best bet is what janetn said - try to sock some money away now and think about how you might handle different financial needs. One benefit of SIP is you won’t be going out to eat or shopping.
Set up as many bill payments on-line as well to avoid needing stamps, etc.
As far as insurance goes, find out about Cobra now rather than later. I know you automatically qualify if you are fired but I don’t know about quitting, or maybe you qualify for less time if you quit (if you get fired it’s 18m). Keep in mind that Cobra is expensive. You might want to do some shopping around now for individual coverage which is also $$$ but better than Cobra (it was for my family of 5 anyway). Bluecross/Blueshield is a solid insurer with reasonable rates. This way if you have to quit and find other coverage you are not scrambling at the last minute.
Well, going to a hospital may not be something you want to do. But if you do and they can actually help you, you cannot be refused emergency care , insurance or not. At least by hospitals that take federal money. If I do not choose to go to work, there is no way I will go to a hospital! If we have a pandemic with a high CFR I really think credit and bill collection will slide for awhile. Repossessions of cars and houses will be conterproductive because the market for resales will be weak, to say the least. Kelly
Does anyone have an idea how large the segment of the US population lives paycheck to paycheck, many in large part because their income is inadeqaute to meet expenses, let alone save substantial amounts?
Oh, and also, check your life insurance and 401 K for hardship loan and withdrawl possibilities. When I was out on medical disability some years ago I had to drain those to stay afloat because disability insurance did not cover enough to pay for all the breakdowns and unexpected problems.
One of the things that might happen in a pandemic would be a large draw down of capital reserves. This is what happened to Tray75 and it would happen to individuals and companies. If a company is forces to continue business because it is “essential” like hospitals, and they had limited or no income then they would have to use their reserves. After a pandemic some funds would never be recouped. Bankruptcy would skyrocket and recession or depression would add to the misery. Kelly
I can barely pay my bills as it is, like many others. If there’s any upside to Pandemic Flu, it’s going to completely reboot the economy. I don’t think we’re going to necessarily descend into some financial chaos. Grimly and Frankly, it’s going to create a lot more jobs, and job openings. If we can behave well enough during the event, I’m pretty sure we’ll be getting up and back to the office soon enough.
I have a hard time imagining being evicted during a pandemic. I imagine everything will be on pause. I can practically see a huge button with that “pause” symbol (||) being pressed.
Satago: It well may be that the loss of workers will make for high employment, but if the “pause button” is hit it does not mean that all payments stop. Farmers need fuel for equipement, hospitals need supplies, the national guard needs food and supplies. All of this can be supplied by using up capital but it may mean a much lower standard of living afterward. Kelly
Np1 You bring up something most of us hsve not thought of. If businesses cant collect on what they are owed soon they will run out of funds too, and cease to operate. The ripple efect will be huge. The recovery after the pandemic could be alot longer and rockier than most of us have planned for
Satago: As a landlord, I know that you cannot evict someone without a court order. There will be no court orders during a pandemic, so I don’t think I would worry about being evicted.
If TSHTF, I would suggest that you phone your landlord and discuss the situation. If he or she knows that you cannot possibly pay during the pandemic but will make every means to “make good” afterwards, that goes a very, very long way.
I would suggest that all of us find a way to pay our health and life insurance. They will be looking for a reason to null and void the policy. Make this a priority and keep meticulous records about the check number, amount and when it was sent. They will certainly claim they never received it! It may make the difference between receiving benefits or not.
All other bills, I plan on sending a letter stating my situation (whatever that might be - not working - just not sure) and my intention to “make good” when all is over and done with. Who knows if anyone will receive the notice but, again, I think it goes a long way in showing intent.
This is all assuming that our creditors will be in the office during any pandemic which is very “iffy”.
If a full blown pandemic hits, there won’t be anyone at the banks to process transactions and there won’t be anyone at mortgage companies to post payments. Everyone will be in this together. They wouldn’t be able to foreclose - who would do it? Besides the whole industry would collapse if they had to foreclose on everyone who couldn’t make their payments. I’m not sure how anyone would get to their money if it’s locked up in a bank. So I would suggest having some around in case you really need it - although I suspect that the bargining system will be used more than cash.
Don’t think that just because a pandemic wipes a bunch of people out, that the economy will have just as many positions available as before. No demand means no need to produce; no need to produce means no job producing it.
I think everyone is beginning to see one of the hosts of things that kept me sleep deprived for about 5 months. The economy will basically have to hunker down, and the world we come out to will never be the same. Life insurance will be taking huge hits, as well as business and disability insurers. This thing will rewrite the entire financial template if it really is a pandemic. We’ll adapt, someway.
Good questions. I guess it depends on how severe the pandemic turns out to be and how suddenly it comes on. Remember who is in office though. He says he is for small business but he is for big business. Unless he has to declare some type of moratorium on bankruptcies, foreclosures, evictions and/or collections he won’t. Pretty sure people already in danger of losing their mortgages or those not current will not have much recourse when the flu strikes.
Janet - I don’t have a landlord, I have an incredibly large beast of a mortgage company. In any case, right, I’m not worried about evictions and such.
Np1 - All this of course depends on how the pandemic hits us and how we all behave during it, but I feel that those who do make it through will be looking to get back to work and normalcy ASAP. While it might be a rough start up I think the survivors will be willing to do what they have to to get things going again.
I am fascinated by the wishful thinking demonstrated by some of these posts. There’s not going to be any kind of assistance or moratoriums (moratoria?). I seriously doubt a pandemic will be grounds for anyone to declare a disaster area….martial law maybe in some places… but not a disaster area. The pandemic will be nationwide. The last thing the government is going to want to do is tell people they don’t have to pay for anything because then the economy will collapse for sure. At least if people are trying to pay their bills there will be some semblance of an economy. Foreclosures, evictions, and car repos will still happen. The courts will make sure of that. Heck, lawyers can file the paperwork from anywhere. You think the lawyers are going to let something like a pandemic affect their cash flow? Fugeddaboutit! And judges and bailiffs will want to keep their jobs, too.
A few years ago large numbers of people (me included) were thrown out of work for a year or two when we had that lengthy downturn in the economy. There were so many of us you would think we would be given some consideration. Nobody cared. You still had to pay your rent or mortgage. You still had to pay your bills. You had to pay your inflated health insurance premiums or you had to do without. If you took money from your 401K to pay your rent or buy food, you still had to pay taxes and penalties on the money you took out.
Credit bureaus won’t be helpful. They will report what they hear about you and believe me if the computer at your creditor says you haven’t paid your bills, it will be more than happy to tell the credit bureau. Don’t think that everyone will be in financial distress. There are many people who will not be. You don’t want to be one of the ones with a crappy credit score once the pandemic is over.
I was about to post a retaliatory rant in response to April’s post, but then it dawned on me she is probably hurt as bad as I was financially post 9/11 and is still just as jaded and bitter. I just can’t see intelligent people going out in a plague to steal back cars no one will buy anyhow, and probably being shot by the owner because they would be mistaken as home invaders or looters threatening their lives by exposing the owner to the flu. Then again, maybe we could award bounties to get the economy back on its feet once each wave passes for taking out businesses heartless enough to be like that. I didn’t see many repo men or foreclosure agents in New Orleans the week after Katrina. All of this IMHO. But if I give myself over to this bitterness and hatred, I won’t be prepped in time, so I have to let it go. Oooommmmmm! Oooommmmm! Breathe!
Janet – at 16:29 --- This is all assuming that our creditors will be in the office during any pandemic which is very “iffy”.
You are so right there! “Iffy” is the operating word.
The thing that I worry about if I’m not able to pay bills, if I have to SIP for any length of time, is that most creditors are automated. What that means is if their computer doesn’t show a payment being made, it automatically reports it as being late. That starts a chain of events that eventually ends up reporting to the “big 3″ credit reporting agencies, like TransUnion, Experion, etc.
I know a lot of people say to heck with their credit report, but coming out the other side of a pandemic, people are going to need credit to get back on their feet. Banks these days don’t do business on a handshake and a promise. They look only at your credit score. If it’s low, as most peoples’ will be…no loan.
I have all of my bills set up on autopay. I’ve got an equity line of credit and no consumer debt. This would be a very good time to get out of debt and put in some real resources to get it out of the way. If TSHTF, all of us are going to be in dicey employment situations, so I don’t want to be up to my eyeballs in debt.
Melanie – at 19:58 — I am green. With envy. Uhm…wanna buy a really nice house on the Left Coast? ;-)
BB,
I have no illusions that I can afford a house on the Left Coast. Don’t be envious: I’ve been unemployed for most of the last four years and the only thing keeping me afloat is home equity and it runs out….
BB, the computer only work if the power and fiber optic are on. Priorities. It’s the people on the edge that keep the wheels of the economy greased. Banks don’t make money on good credit, they make money on late fees and over-drafts. They like for us to spend beyond our means. You guys keep that financial preparedness stuff up and all the bad credit people die in the flu, the banks are going to have to charge you extra for being on time.
TRay75 – at 20:07 --- I’ve been in banks when the power’s been out. Most of the main offices have generators they they run at the end of the day to complete the day’s transactions. Same for the credit bureaus…even if they run on dial-up modems, they can still xfer most of their data in under an hour.
I know, I built some mega-campuses with enough emergency generator capacity to power small cities in the past, during the good years.
But it seems that the idea of maintaining financial normalcy when over half the working population will not be paid or able to work would not server the public good. Destitute people fall back to government assistance and medical care, as well as crime and other social ills to try to survive. No one wants this to happen, and no one will benefit by wrecking millions of lives by rigid enforcement of status quo if TSHTF. America will become a third world power quickly like that. Of course, we do have an executive branch that is more like royalty than justly elected public servants doing the best for the most (Didn’t we have a war with a guy like that about 230 years ago?).
Either way, with me just starting to pull myself back up, another 10 years of bad credit won’t matter much anyhow. I have had to learn to live on a cash basis, even if it meant my children went without and we neglected basic health care to pay for emergencies (that like the energizer bunny keep going, and going, and going). If finances are another thing to worry about, then I don’t think my sanity will survive even if I do. Imagine millions like me out there, having to face rebuilding as little more than slaves. That is the only time I think it better to go out like the family at the end of “On the Beach” being a real possibility if the pandemic does hit us. Will the economy support the mental health care to bring us back from that under Medicaid?
And Monday afternoon I found out my job is about to be eliminated, so it makes keeping hope and optimism pretty difficult if I stay in this thread. I addition to prepping, which I was just really getting started at, now I have to look for an new job, and likely relocating at my own expense. Being a contract to perm worker during a hiring-freeze / reduction-in-force you don’t get severance or outplacement assistance. I hope to find something in emergency management and support if I can. That is going to be a growth industry for a few years, I would expect. I know this is way too emotional to continue for me. I want to help somewhere, someway to prepare and help as many people as I can.
I apologize if I offended anyone. Good luck guys.
Me – at 16:31
I’m inclined to agree with you. You can’t eat cash, or do anything constructive with it.
Folks, not to be snotty, but putting the economy on “hold” has no precedent. Do not make your plans around that assumption.
There may be some companies who will allow you to debt restructure, but there may just as many who will not … just because THEY can’t afford to be that generous.
There aren’t any golden parachutes here. My suggestion is that you restructure now, or whatever it is that you can. If you are living hand to mouth now, you are still just as vulnterable to a wobble in the economy without a pandemic event as you are if one occured.
Don’t plan on a pandemic event making things better. A debt is a debt and the new bankruptcy laws have changed a lot of things in the last couple of years.
And don’t plan on a pandemic event adding a lot of new job openings. If there are more empty jobs, that means that there are also fewer customers to access and therefore many of those jobs will simply evaporate.
Just like we are preparing now physically and emotionally as best we can, we also need to address economic preparation now … not later, and not under the assumption that Big Brother is going to catch us.
I’ve been working overtime to pay off my debts and build up my savings. It sucks right now but I want to have some options when TSHTF (work or don’t work). I figure if we dodge the Bird Flu Bullet, I’ll still be better off.
Deb Ive been doing the same thing. Working my tail off since last fall. We are debt free and by fall we will have enough food for us and my sons family, and enough money for the basics. We have gone without a lot of goodies, and Ive been bone tired. Its been worth the peace of mind, Im finally seeing the light at the end of the tunnel.
TRay75 Sorry about your job loss. That just plain sucks. My DH lost his job during every economic downturn since the 70s. It wasnt fun wondering how we were going to keep a roof over our heads and feed the kids was horrible. So I have some empathy for what your going through. I hope you find something soon.
After the September 11 2001 attack, we were told to get out of our homes and go shopping, see a play, take a trip and go out to dinner. It was our patriotic duty not to let the terrorists win by interfering with our economy. We were also told that the terrorists were going to attack again at any given time, the alerts were heightened and we were advised to be suspicious of any and all packages, people and strange activities we might observe. At no time were we advised to prepare for the eventual repercussions such an attack may bring. Power plants and dams were under strict observation, but no official advice was given on how to get through a power or water disruption. I think this speaks volumes about the general consensus of the population by those in charge. They feed us sound bites, tell us half-truths and expect us to look no further into the possible consequences of the very acts they warn us about. To expect much more from this bunch in a pandemic situation would seem to be beyond optimistic. I can foresee “feel good” news releases encouraging volunteerism (to cover those positions where the original employees are sick or dead), Rosie the Riveter type posters stating that America gets going when the going if tough and advising us to get back to work and all types of misinformation designed to downplay the seriousness of the situation. Expecting a moratorium on debts and obligations may be the biggest mistake anyone can make. I would suggest that now is the time to go shopping and put away everything you can cash wise. Please don’t depend on the kindness of others especially the government.
Melanie: I have most of my bills on autopay also but I do have one huge concern. These bills are paid on assumed “income”. If, for some reason, I am in the unfortunate position where my company won’t pay during time off for a pandemic, the bills may automatically continue to be paid and the bank will switch over to taking out of savings, lines of credit, etc, whatever else is attached to my checking account.
I, for one, will cease all autopayments once TSHTF. I don’t want to assume that I would be able to do so during the pandemic in that who knows if the Internet will be up and running to communicate with the bank. Their internal systems may still function (still be able to debit your account to pay bills), but we may not be able to access our accounts and make changes - if we choose to not have things paid through autopay.
I don’t want the bank automatically pulling from other accounts that are linked to checking. Do you worry about the same?
Janet: I’m with you, I pay all my bills online but have none setup for autopay for a couple of reasons. First is even though I have been doing EFT since the 70′s I just don’t have all that much faith in banks as their main concern is themselves - not a single little account holder. Next reason is that I want to see my bills before they are paid, there is way too much ID theft going on and mistakes do happen, like overcharging, double charges, or just wrong charges.
Paying each one (bill) as they come takes very little time as I spend way too much time on line anyway. I am not all that concerned about the net going down as the government and finical institutions will make sure it is one of the primary things that stay up, for communications and of course to ensure that get their money in a timely fashion.
bump for cherokee rose
I think a pandemic will bring in new laws regarding debt, bill payments, mortgage foreclosure etc. But before that happens I believe the government will work with financial institutions who will work with corporations who will work with individuals to make plans to progressively bring the economy back to normal asap. Moral suasion by government to have financial institutions (including but not limited to banks, brokerage houses, credit bureaus, insurance companies and other lenders) already planning for such an event is likely well underway.
There is a mindset that nothing will happen if you don’t pay your bills/mortgage. It is my belief that if you can show them a plan to get things back on track you are far better off than burying your head in the sand and hope they do nothing. Also I think you give away your power if you let others decide what happens to your home etc. If you take initiative they are much more likely to work with you. Just mho.
There will likely be immense pressure on corporations to keep people working. If a corporation fails to provide for their employees aren’t they partially responsible for financial hardships. In other words if a company could have set up an incentive plan to house and care for a portion of their employees and families within their facilities shouldn’t they be held accountable. I’m referring to large companies like banks etc. I actually think plans like this are underway for lots of businesses.
Anyone counting on a “pass go” card to get out of debt will find very little support from joe public. You repaying your debt is what will help everyone get back to normal faster. I think what you may see is finally those who are living beyond their means will see their standard of living drop significantly and those who have used debt responsibly and not overextended themselves will recover quickly. I don’t think those financially responsible are going to let debtors get off lightly. I know some situations have been caused by layoffs, divorce, illness etc.but overall too many have been downright irresponsible in spending future income on todays latest desire. Just how I see it.
I plan on working right through the pandemic until/unless I get sick . MY big concern is that my paycheck may not be deposited (direct deposit).
Just an update, and Kathy, please, no further bashing. This is for the few people here that understand my situation.
My job is being continued another 30 days, and for that I am grateful. I will be prepping as best I can. I am debt free, just with a credit history ruined by the unscrupulous acts of a disability insurer 4 years ago.
My biggest concern is getting out of the area around Camden, NJ (I live in a “boro” just a highway to the south of Camden). If ever I saw a place suck hope and financial responsibility from human beings, driving (quickly, with windows up) through some streets there will make you realize how good your lives are. People left here with money, if civil unrest breaks out as it is likely to do, will die from robbery and home invasion. Gangs here have repeatedly used AK-47′s on each other. I don’t care if I’m broke, that’s nothing new, as long as I and my kids are alive. Coming here was a desperate move to try to restart my life at my wife’s request. I regret having done it.
How will you protect your finances from fraud and theft after the pandemic? My involuntary answer is to have none to protect.
TRay75 – at 22:15
I was in no way bashing you. My husband and I both have suffered lay offs, hour reductions, etc. The first time it happened we were just back from our honeymoon … three days later the Savings and Loan gave him the boot with no warning.
My husband suffered terribly from the Savings and Loan debacle of the 80′s and 90′s. He was in banking … started out in Students Loans and worked his way into Commerical Banking. He worked in banking 17 years and none of those years were stable … between restructuring and buy-outs, etc.
But since we have “been there, done that” I can say what I said without guilt. Also, having experience in the behind the scenes banking industry gives us a unique perspective on how finely everything is balanced.
We finally had to get out on our own and start our own business … hubby couldn’t take yet one more lay off. So now we are completely dependent on our own ingenuity. We are property managers. That in and of itself is causing some problems when it comes to trying to figure out a business plan to allows for continuity when it comes to a pandemic. We have a lot of financial and legal obligations to meet … not to mention some moral ones to the tenents themselves.
Take it however you want, but without a precendent for putting the economy on “hold” and no real way to effect continuity if such a thing was to occur, it only makes sense to plan based on currently known factors and not on “hope.”
I do sympathize, but its because we’ve been there. Our solution isn’t for everyone. Self-employment can be just plain scary.
Thank you, Kathy, I much better understand where you are coming from and apologize for the emotional intensity of my responses. Having been born in low income, making moves up, and loosing it to dishonest insurance practices has soured me - and it gets out of hand when I need to be clinical about it. Finances are well known to be the worst subject to discuss and even cause marriages to crumble. I wish you and your husband the best, and hope your tenants appreciate the fact that you have considered them and the consequences of the possible pandemic in your planning.
You may want to check news updates and discussions on possible changes in the virus via mammals in some of the threads today. I understand enough from them to think we may be running shorter on time than we hoped, so you sound to be ready to finalize things if and when things turn bad.
I would like to share the experience on what´s happening in Norway this weekend. The finance sector is threatening with strike on monday. This quickly resulted in two things. First there was a huge cue on every mini-bank machine in the entire country. After a few hours all machines went out of cash. Secondly the fear of not getting the salary money into peoples bank account crashed most of the internet-banks, keeping them of-line for two days. All this was because of a strike that will probably last only for 2–3 days. The threat was also that paying cards would stop functioning, thats why everybody wanted to get their cash.
lesson learned, on of the most important preps are some cash..
Urdar-Norge – at 09:21
Ouch! What a national situation to be faced with.
Here in the US there are a lot of federal laws that control banking … from the amount of cash that each bank branch is required to have on hand to the number of days per week they are required to be open to customers. Also, banks do not have unions per se so therefore cannot really “strike.”
I can foresee a “run” on cash though … it happens during hurricane emergencies.
the right to strike is fundamental here, even the police have this right. But what happens is, if the strike threatens people or animals health its being stopped by government. And they decide what the outcome of the negotioation should be. Its a good system and is a part of the early summmer feeling :)
Urdar-Norge How is all this affecting you? Are you ok? My bet would be that you are better prepared than most to deal with the ‘unexpected’.Let us know what else you may observe as a consequence!
US bank employees can not strike necessarily but they certainly can decide not to show up for work. Or, even open their doors for that matter if they think the situation is unsafe. I can totally see what happened in Norway happening here, only far worse. If TSHTF people will be in a panic. I’ve spent a lot of time in Norway. People are extremely polite. Guns are totaly restricted. Plus people knew it was likely a short-term situation so weren’t totally “oy my god my life could end” ind of panic. Here, banks would quickly run out of what cash they do have or have to start restricting the amounts taken in withdrawls. It could get ugly quickly.
It is hard to say what may happen to the economy during or after the flu, here are some numbers from 1918.
The business contractions average around 20%, expansions 24%. There was a lift in the economy due to the end of WWI, but it does not appear that the economy suffered terribly after the 1918 flu. Yes, it was the beginning of the Roaring Twenties, but an expansion after our flu may not be ruled out either.
Business Cycle Reference Dates ----Duration in Months----
Trough Peak Contraction Expansion
Previous Peak Trough to
to Trough Peak
Dec. 1914 Aug. 1918 23 44* Mar. 1919 Jan. 1920 7 10 July 1921 May 1923 18 22
reference: http://www.albany.edu/~renshaw/leading/ess13.html
The government in 1918 restricted media coverage of any that took away from the war efforts. People were in many cases not aware of what was happening or that it was serious. They were lied to by officials. With info out there we are now a better informed public but it is debatable whether what we here is complete truth. But more will be aware especially in countries where the internet is popular.
I see the cost of flu preparedness on the corporations having a bottom line effect. I see people choosing to SIP meaning a huge employee absenteeism.
Yes the economy will be affected, how severe depends on many factors.
But I don’t expect that the public officials lying to the public will change much in 2006 from 1918. We have already seen pretty strong evidence of that.
Also, all ATMs (those not attached to bank buildings) have to be loaded by security companies, which as Kathy in FL said is another reason ATMs run out of cash in hurricane crisis aside from loss of power and phone/data lines. To supply the ATMs armored car companies need first to have cash, coming from the central bank locations supplied from the Federal Reserve Bank in the region from the US Mints. Any break in that chain and the cash system goes down.
Then all that is left is electronic transfer, if the people in the processing centers show up rather than SIPing. This could get messy. Some centers could stay up, while others go down, so ETF (electronic fund transfer) could be unreliable. And if the hour I spent on the phone tonight with the cable company is any indication, ETF is already unreliable (they charge my account with a bounce fee when I never made a payment on that date. It took a human and 2 computer systems to track it down and find that someone had keyed in the wrong account with MY bank number!)
The system isn’t flawless even when it works normally. Best keep a paper trail back-up, and I just realized that Quicken isn’t going to work to track things without power or data communications. Add an accountant to your preps list!
I did some thinking on this in a thread called “a simple plan.” It is a closed thread somewhere on this site. Sorry I am too tied to look for it..going to bed.
Tray is right about EFT - they get screwed up all the time. I’m planning on moving some money to a second bank to help cover our bases - in case one bank is in shambles hopefully the other will function. Our current bank is hopeless but convenient. Complex transactions send them into fits. They are the biggest in our area so if they crash lots of people are in trouble.
Truthfully, I don’t have any money in a bank to worry about. Many peoples balances go up only so the bill can be paid, then it drops back down toa negligible level. So as far as my own personal affect on the banking system goes…they might lose some of the ridiculous overdraft fees, but that’s about it. They won’t notice my absence.
I don’t think the economy will be “put” on hold, I just think that during the pandemic, particularly the worst of it, people will be too busy with other things to be paying thier bills. Probably won’t be able to anyway. How? Mail? Online or phone payments? I don’t expect amnesty for the X number of months I won’t be sending out checks. I expect to pick right up where I left off ASAP. It’s not really even a question of them “letting” people do this, and if they’re good business people they’ll realize it’s better to keep a customer than to lose one.
But really, who knows. All speculation anyway.
Old thread - Closed