Just thought us Canadians could assemble and keep in touch/ help each other re: our own local preparations.
Any news/ word as to preparations happening in Canada? Anyone besides yourself that you know of here prepping yet?
There’s barely a word of the bird flu in local media yet. I saw a Toronto Star article on bird flu about a month ago, that’s it.
Personally, (I’m in Ontario) I’ve begun prepping, but in small small amounts, since I just don’t have the time yet or the money yet (still a student….) but am trying to at least keep up to date on a daily basis.
I am in rural New Brunswick and I have just barely started prepping. I have full intentions of stepping it up, and soon. I plan to put in a good sized garden this spring as well. I just asked the other hockey mom’s about their understanding of the BF this morning. I recieved a mixed responce, some said they didn’t want to think about it because it was scary, others said they have enough to worry about now. I was relieved to find out that our local medical clinic ( in a village of 600–800 people ) has started having meetings about being prepared. They will be offering free classes to our locals teaching us how to take care of infected people and other pertinent info. I asked if they have a Community plan. Was very happy to hear that the plan is to keep outsiders out of our community in the case of an outbreak. The fact that we are talking makes me feel better.
ricewiki
I expect that our issues won’t be much different than those in the US. I’m happy the American’s are being advised to prep. It may force our goverment to say something… anything.
Re: news reports. The Star has had almost daily stories on events in Europe and Asia but usually buried past page 10.
Don’t be discouraged by your efforts so far. Keep at it, at what ever pace.
FYI, I just responded to you in the Who is here from outside US thread.
EB,
Yep, saw your post… thanks…
True, Canada will need similar preps to the US of course…
I just think it’s nice to hear from each other and what we’re doing, since there are less of us… even as of course a virus is completely transnational.
EB, I’ll repost here what you wrote “for another thread.”
“I started paying attention after the CBC docu-drama in January. Fifth Estate, I think. Eye opening to say the least. Then I read John Barry’s book the following week. That put me over the edge. Went into prep mode the next day… sensibly but always moving forward. I work for a local municipality and happened to mention it to our Emergency Management coordinator. Turns out he had been trying to move the issue up the priority list for a few weeks. He was eventually successful as we now have a committee, first meeting is next week, and I have been asked to participate. I’m looking forward to it. I understand the pressure that is placed on a local government, since they are closest to the electorate, and I understand any reluctance to react to this issue. It will be our duty as a committee to advise as best we can and hope that the right people take notice. Personally, I have talked to a handful of people at work and all of them have taken notice. I directed everyone of them to fluwiki because this site has helped me put my preps into a context I can deal with. This is an amazing resource! My wife is on board as is my son who lives in TO. I’m still working on my parents and sisters but with gentle and regular reminders I expect they will onboard soon too.”
I think it’s great that you have caused some actual change and awareness here. I hope the meeting goes well. I would be interested to see the outcome of it. Wonder if we will see any of them on fluwikie.
I am so happy to share the fact that the very small(pop 600)village that I live in (rural New Brunswick, Can.)is having a public meeting this week. Our community is working closely with a couple of nearby villages to come up with a plan. I am anxious to find out what their plan is and how it might involve my family and I. I will let you know what I learn at the meeting on Thursday. It is reassuring just to know that we have a group here that is on the ball.
Thanks Eaglebabe, I would definitely be interested in finding out what is discussed.
To all of our Canadian Friends
My dear friend lives in Alberta and I live in the states.
She and I have agreed since 911 that we must make a pact to protect both of our families.
She knows that she and her family are always welcome here. In turn I know that my family is also welcome at her home.
We have discussed the bird flu, the draft(I have 3 teenage sons), and any disater that might happen.
I would like to suggest to all of you, if you also have someone that you love and trust in the states, talk to them. Make some type of plans We all need to work together.
I would like to share my reality with my US family and friends.
I have at least 14 more house to find in my rural area for them.
I am convinced that Canadians must realised that US families & friends will come up if things get’s bad.
Already some people I know are preparing this.
I’m in Alberta and I certainly hadn’t considered relatives or friends coming up from US. What is the basis of that assumption? Good heavens I was already stressing about family in Canada showing up on my doorstep now I have to consider those from the US too.
I don’t think we’ll see the “flight or fight” mentality so many are talking about. I do think those living in small apartments/condos that don’t have utilities may think of heading to the country.
We’ve discussed it and we will hand out care packages (food/water) but we aren’t taking people in to our home. If it’s that bad then they add a lot of risk to our self-quarantine. I know people won’t like my thinking but I especially won’t take in families with children because I consider them the greatest risk of carrying the virus. I don’t expect people would be willing to follow my rules to the letter about staying safe; that being the case they put us at risk so the answer has to be no; here’s a helping hand but off you go.
Hi Folks From Eastern Canada.Newfoundland ( no jokes please )
It is so nice to hear from other Canadians. After watching the Fifth Estate Show, my family also began prepping.
The problem I see is that a lot of people I have talked to have no real concept of what is actually on the go, and when you try and discuss it with them they go into automatic denial, or look totally freaked after you tell them and then
denial.
So we began some quiet prep on our own but without anyone else to talk to about it is very lonesome ( so to speak).
Grin - having said that.. Does anyone know of some canadian distributers to obtain some “supplies” from..
Cheers
If you live near a Mountain Equipment Co-op or EuropeBound store, they have quite a few supplies to get you started…
Also could try army surplus stores.
When was this Fifth Estate show on? What station? Think they have a website for the program?
ricewiki
Check out the CBC. Btw, great work on the index.
Cdn-Wes - My wife and I love Newfoundland… and Newfoundlanders! We have been a number of times, many for a long weekend in St. Johns just to get away. Keep prepping. I suspect those around you heard what you said but need a bit more time.
We are in southern ontario in a very rural area. Our local Health Unit is also running info seminars. It is comforting to see that our region is addressing the situation. The “learn about” page is suprisingly detailed for a small community.
Ricewiki.
The show was the Fifth Estate and was broadcast on January 11 2006. They used the scenario of a canadian city and some of the problems.
Hope this helps. I am not sure if the link works so sorry folks ..
Take a look at the City of Toronto Pandemic Plan (link is elsewhere in this website) - looks a bit on the ‘thin’ side to me in comparison to US comparables?! I am in Northumberland County - no sign of any community prep here - nothing on Haliburton Kawartha Pine Ridge Health Unit website. I have written to them asking what if anything they are planning, but no response of course!
Hey!!! where are you guys??!! I posted last message in the middle of the night - no replies yet?? Did anybody check out the TO plan?? Do I assume everybody is ‘just fine’ with the current level of govt management/plan/prep on this issue? Or… are you all still digesting your good fresh Ontario Farmland dinners (no canned stuff!!) and thinking?
Hi! This is my first posting, although I have been a ‘lurker’ for months. I am also in rural New Brunswick and we moved here from Ontario a little over a year ago, partly for just this sort of occurance. We now have a couple of acres, a wood cookstove, lots of wood, a well, a garden, fruit trees, and a cold cellar and lots of pantries that we have been stocking with food. Another thing we have been doing is purchasing heritage (or heirloom) seeds so that if things go bottom up for whatever reason, we can grow our own food without having to purchase seeds. Most seeds that you purchase in a store are infertile, ie. their seeds will not produce because they are hybrids. Its a little trick seed companies have done, partly to make people keep buying seeds instead of saving their own. I hope we have time to put our garden in before this thing hits, although it seems to be coming closer and closer the last few days. My husband studied microbiology at Guelph U. and he has always said that it is a virus that will inherit the earth, not cockroaches!
I’m in the west so no need to check out Toronto’s plan. But for that matter I’m not using government sites as a source; I’m using Fluwikie and news sites. I feel we have to make our own plans and our plan is to be prepared to self-quarantine for months if need be.
Well, I am from Toronto and have been busy starting my prep. Have not read the plan, maybe this weekend. But I do notice that our federal Minister of Health started his first public speech on congratulating Ontario chicken farmers how good a job they are doing with bio-security (therefore no one should fear eating Ontario chicken) and at the same time on CTV trying to reassure the public that ‘we have learned a lot from SARS’. He was the Ontario Minister of Health when SARS hit and at the time he was running around convincing WHO Ontario should be removed from the no-travel list in order to save the travel industry. It seems to me there is more interest in protecting business and ‘the economy’ than encouraging the public to prepare. I don’t think he learned anything from SARS. As I recall, during SARS, after Ontario announced the all clear, a group of nurses at a North Toronto hospital reported to their management of suspicious symptoms and that SARS may be coming back. The microbiologist of the hospital insisted despite warnings from the nurses that the was no evidence of a come back. It did re-emerge and more nurses and patients (don’t remember how many) died. The management and the government were under pressure not to tell the world that SARS was coming back because of the strong travel industry lobby.
This time, instead of the travel industry, it is the chicken farmers. While I don’t disagree with supporting the chicken farmers on a very difficult undertaking, I think the government should not deflect attention from the potential problems. I think the U.S. government’s handling of the situation is a lot more responsible.
History repeating itself.
Read this item from CTV News about how clueless the government is:
Hi! This is also my first post. I’m from rural Nova Scotia and have been keeping an eye on the avian flu for a while now, but have only recently started spending time at FluWiki. I must say there’s quite a lot of very good and helpful information here.
I’ve been stockpiling stuff for a while but have recently started increasing how much stuff I’m adding to my stash; I’m getting a little freaked out at how much more we’re hearing abou the bird flu and how much faster it seems to be spreading. However, I’m shocked at how few people in the world are aware of any of this and how few are doing anything about it. I recently called my 3 sisters to check their level of knowledge and preparedness and was floored when they said they had heard a little bit about the bird flu in the news but had no idea it could develop into something as serious and scary as a pandemic. I just hope they took me seriously and are preparing. I also can’t beleive how little we’re hearing from Canadian “officials” about avian flu, possible pandemic, government plans, suggested preparations etc. Makes one that much more determined to be self-sufficient and self-reliant through all of this because I don’t think we’re going to get much outside help.
My concern is that the ‘Toronto Plan’ is supposed to be ‘state of the art’ because of our experience with SARS. Designed as a ‘model’ that other communities could use. It does seem to be comprehensive in terms of medical management of suspected AI cases and protecting the health care workers - all very important aspects. But I did not see anything about alerting the public to extended quarantine or the need to stockpile provisions and OTC medicines etc (unless I missed it?), the possibility of collapse of the infrastructure of our communities and so on. I wonder if that is because it was drafted before the current developments in Europe and the Middle East, or because the dont want people to panic? Perhaps this is the influence of ‘naysayers’ like Dr Schabas? I think we need to press our politicians to get the message out that people need to be preparing!!
Received today from Haliburton Kawartha Pine Ridge Health Unit - (Ontario)- feel free to post comments!
Dear - - - Thanks for your inquiry. The Haliburton, Kawartha, Pine Ridge District Health Unit has been working on an Influenza Pandemic Contingency Plan since September 2005. The planning process started by engaging key stakeholders, the idea is to instill in them that the time for planning is now. Local planning requires the input and support from various level of government, health-care services, and other agencies. Organizations involved in local planning are encouraged to: - Connect with health-care services E.g. Acute-care facilities, LTCH etc. - Review existing pandemic influenza plans Canada Plan, Ontario Plan,professional body plan (Business Continuity Plan). - Identify opportunities to share resources during a pandemic - Look for the ability to maximize their resources (both human resources and supplies/equipment) - Discuss their role(s) during an influenza pandemic - Identify the services their organizations will be able to provide - Identify likely disruptions that will occur during an influenza pandemic
The Health Unit plan is being developed using the provincial plan as a template, our two main responsibilities are: 1- Develop an active surveillance program within HKPR District to monitor influenza activity in the community and perhaps detect the novel virus, 2- Develop a mass immunization plan; the Health Unit will be responsible and accountable for the distribution of vaccine to priority groups first and then to the rest of population.
I hope I have answered your question, if you need further information, please do not hesitate to contact me.
Younous Manjoura Pandemic Influenza Preparedness Manager
gharris – at 11:28
Some questions:
1. please ask for a list of ‘stakeholders’ - in particular does that include schools, transit authorities 2. ‘develop a mass immunization plan’ - there is no vaccine probably for a few months after the first wave hits, wondering about the priorities - see next point about containment 3. any plan or protocol for quarantine, self-quarantine, isolation (I am not a health care professional, so pardon my lack of understanding) 4. based on the tone of the letter, it seems that higher priority is given to ‘business continuity’ than to ‘containment’ - my biggest fear is a repeat of SAR wave 2. The planners and administrators are constrained by political directive to inadvertently sacrifice containment in favour of business continuity. IMHO, we need our political leaders to change the tone so that the professional managers are allowed to do their work. While ‘business continuity’ is a laudable objective, ‘containment’ must take precedence over it.
The devil is in the details. I think even the spin doctors should realize that the jurisdiction with the most water tight containment would also have the best chance of achieving business continuity AND business confidence.
Thanks Eaglebabe, I would definitely be interested in finding out what is discussed.
Well folks here is what we learned at our community meeting this evening… Our local communities have put in place the “ Pandemic Influenza Contingency Planning Group “(PICPG). In a meeting that lasted apro. 2 hrs, which only a couple of dozen people turned up for, we were given a folder containing printed information such as; PanFlu planning checklist, safety checklist,estimated # of cases by outcome for our locality, family communications plan list, a fact sheet for caring of a flu patient & a bird flu facts pamplet(www.survivetheflu.com). We were also given info. about the PICPG and their misson statement, “ Neighbour Helping Neighbour “. We were given a calendar of planned free lectures, info. sessions(infection control,nutrition, diagnostics, medical emergencies, cardiac and respiratory emergencies, be prepared not scared disaster response, drug administration, wounds and bleeding, oxygen therapy, Home care, shock,unconciousness & fainting ) First Aid & CPR Clinics & mask fitting clinics for front line workers in our area. Just knowing that such a group is in place in our community with a plan in action is a relief in itself. We are now being given the oppurtunity to volunteer to be apart of this plan. Everything from administration, fundraising, emergency services to homecare. I hope this info. will help others by knowing what another community is doing to prepare. Hopefully we will have a website up and running in the near future, which I will be sure to pass along.
Eaglebabe 20:48
Where/when did this meeting take place?? In Canada?? Who organized it? individuals or municipal govt??
gharris – at 22:55
Where/when did this meeting take place?? In Canada?? Who organized it? individuals or municipal govt??
The meeting was held on Wed. Mar 22 in our community in rural New Brunswick, Canada. It is made up of local councils, Fire Depts., EMO’s & RCMP.
Hi guys! Looks like I’m the only one from Manitoba so far, a little itty-bitty town about an hour north of Winnipeg. I would love to tell you that my community is prepping- but nothing so far. Eaglebabe, your town sounds like it’s well on it’s way to being really prepared. I’m glad to hear it!
If anyone hears of any community in Ontario prepping or otherwise planning, let me know! It will be good info-leverage for the skeptics over here…
Thanks gharris for the note you posted…
Hello from Victoria, B.C. Happy to see a canadian website. Have you seen some of the emergency supply lists for surviving the pandemic? Extensive and useful, but some foodstuffs are not available in Canada. We should derive our own list of items that are available in the true north strong….. I am inspired by the above posts to work harder at organizing on a local level. I have been prepping for a month or more now. One step at a time, but if it occupies your thinking at times each day then you are ahead just for percieving of the journey to come. Especially agree with keeping items of high survival value for others who ask and being firm with your rules on self quarantine. No point being self sufficient to have a slip up cost the life of your child.
Welcome, Tree Man! Nice to hear from B.C. Know many preppers over there yet?
As for Canadian stores for prepping, I find MEC helpful. Of course, the usual dollar stores and Shoppers Drug Mart are great for many items, too — as is the average grocery store.
Greetings all from London, Ontario.
This too is my first time posting. Suddenly I don’t feel so alone knowing there is fellow Canadians worried about this. I have been following bird flu closely for months now and have started stockpiling supplies. This scares the crap out of me and noone (coworkers, friends, family) has ever brought this subject up in conversation. I question myself all the time (am I overreacting, getting paranoid etc.)so it is comforting knowing there are “others out there”. lol.
ricewiki:
London’s Middlesex London Health Unit released their Pandemic Preparedness* Report in January. It is 119 pages long and quite informative. They have definately thought it out. You might find it interesting.
Welcome, roadranger! Nice to have you on the site… hope you stick around and find it useful and not become as addicted — oops —
The flu wiki is a very useful place. I’m working with Dem and some others (Owl, Lugon, Will, Kim) to build an index of all of our discussion topics. You can see the link from the main discussion forum page. It will give you an idea of what topics have already been brought up etc.
roadranger, btw, how did you find out about the fluwiki?
Just curious…
Hi rice, Yes I was just reading some of the other topics. I’m going to try and find John Barry’s book tomorrow.
I saw the episode Oprah did on bird flu and was reading their message boards when the name fluwiki kept being mentioned so I thought I would check it out.
Now I’m hooked.
Thanks for the guide tip, Roadranger.
For anyone in the southwestern Ontario area:
London, Ont is holding a Pandemic Preparedness Meeting for the Public. Their 119-pg guide is available on their emergency website.
The meeting is May 9 at Centennial Hall, 550 Wellington St. 1–4pm or 6–9pm.
Hi all,
I’m in Vancouver and have been following this for quite some time now. Did some surfing back in the fall and found lots of documents online regarding planning at the provincial level and among our regional health authorities. Lots of detailed documents & evidnce that they are meeting and updating the plans, but not sure how far that will take us. The province has also hosted forums to encourage businesses to plan. The provincial plans also talk about involving citizen volunteers in a crisis situation but I’ve seen absolutely nothing encouraging citizen engagement or participantion at the community level or encouraging individual citizens to think about the issue or individual prep.I recently attended one of the city’s disaster prep workshops, which focus entirely on earthquake prep—and not a peep about pandemic or H5N1.
We seems to have very little Canadian H5N1 news in the Canadian media (just what’s happening overseas) and we’re hearing absolutely nothing from Ottawa that’s comparable to Levitt’s warnings in the US.
I have heard that front-line docs in Vvancouver were recently briefed on the provincial/regional pandemic plans. They naturally expect surge capacity problems (respirators etc) although they are using a very low mortality rate in their planning. I was also struck by the revelation that they intend to keep our schools open in a pandemic! It seems foolhardy to plan with the assumption that contingency plans for school closures WON’T be needed (since the reality is that no one’s going to send the kids to schools anyway if something serious hits us).
I’ve seen very few signs of people taking it seriously out here, although I finally ran into my first aquaintance who is actually worried enough to follow the news.
Greetings from Rocky Mountain House, Alberta. I went to a meeting in Red Deer recently, put on by Red Deer College and the David Thompson Health Region people. (The first of its kind in all of Alberta.) It mostly focussed on how businesses can cope and to let us know how ready THEY are. A lot of good that will do since the public HAS NOT BEEN INFORMED and everyone who doesn’t get the flu will probably starve to death instead! They showed us a picture of their Tamiflu stores and told us the location is being kept a big secret! (I can see it now. The politicians and the medical people will grab their box of Tamiflu supplies and run for the bunkers leaving the rest of the country in total unprepared panic!) They said they have been preparing for this pandemic for the last 5 years and they predict it is going to happen in the next 12 to 18 months. Absolutely NO ONE I have talked to has any clue of the disaster that is almost upon us. No one even knows what Tamilfu is, let alone know enough to ask their doctor for it. Everyone is trusting the government fully, to inform them of any danger they should prepare for. Ha! What a joke! The flu is almost here and the silence is DEAFENING! Is it possible the government is unconcerned that a lot of people will die? Are there some people that stand to gain something from the death of a lot of people? A conspiracy??? I am telling everyone I know. I give them this website as a starting point to get acquainted with the situation and how to prepare for it. But it’s a hard sell. Nobody wants their bubble burst.
Bird flu fears have Canadians stockpiling for pandemic
poll: Majority supports mandatory quarantine of those infected
One million Canadians are stockpiling food, water, medicine and cash in preparation for a bird flu pandemic and nearly all citizens support court-ordered quarantines for those exposed to the virus, a new survey revealed.
http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/story.html?id=7c78aa0a-f5c6-4f2d-adb6-346528a87655
Hi everyone, I have been a reader of this site for months, my husband as well. We both find this site wonderfully helpful. As a mother my instincts are in full swing, thinking of every possible bean, and cooking ingredient to store to make my childrens lives as normal as possible during our hibernation from the outside world. I am trying to stay rational and level headed about this but its mortalitly rate seems to be rising, so are my fears. And the fact that it seems to infect the younger population doesnt make me feel any better. to be honest with you all im scared.
I called my mother last night and she said she was watching the local news (we live in rural Nova Scotia) and almost fell over when she heard them stating that the avian flu will not spread to humans and that there will be no pandemic. I guess they must know something that the rest of us don’t… This makes me want to scream! I just got my sisters convinced that this is coming and to start prepping (my Mom’s already on board). So now I’m wondering if they saw this silly newscast and decided that I’m the one over-reacting and being paranoid. It really bothers me that they can make a blanket statement like that knowing that there are lots of people out there who are believing everything they say. After all they are the news and they should know - shouldn’t they???
I also haven’t heard a peep about any plans or preparations in our area and have been thinking about trying to broach the subject with our neighbours and at least try to get some sort of plan in place for our community. Of course, if no one wants to believe a pandemic is possible (because the news station is telling them it isn’t going to happen) I don’t necessarily want the whole neighbourhood knowing I have been prepping and have a big stash of stuff here. Maybe I should hold off on trying to organize the entire community for now and instead just try to talk to a few of the neighbours and get them thinking about it and later try to gauge if they’re taking this seriously or not before organizing any community meetings. What to do? I just know we’d do so much better as a group trying to get through this instead of everyone for themselves. I don’t want to be visiting with my neighbours if they get sick, but I’m sure there are ways we could help each other to make it easier for ourselves. Guess I need to think about this some more. Anyone have any suggestions what a rural community could do to band together and what sorts of things we could all do to help each other (without risking infecting each other). I think there would be greater safety in numbers as far as watching out for each other. Maybe we could also centralize some things like garbage storage (with scheduled drop offs) so we’d only have one area to clean up afterwards, gathering water (we all have wells that would be useless without power but we also live on a river) and making sure our elderly neighbours have enough on hand - we could drop it off at the end of the driveways or leave it on doorsteps. I just wish I had a better idea what others around me were thinking/doing about all of this. Or maybe it’s nuts to even think about getting people to work together because we could just end up increasing the possibility of spreading the flu. Thoughts, opinions, suggestions, ideas anyone? (This is quite a small, close knit community - we have lots of people who are related to each other living near each other.)
It seems that we Canadians are planning very quietly. If an estimated 1 million are stocking up (according to the poll in the Ottawa citizen today) and none of us are hearing or seeing anything happening with our friends, relatives & neighbours!
RottieMom, I agree that the mixed messages are extremely frustrating.
It seems that the failure to engage individual citizens and local communities is a common pattern across most of the country — and very much the opposite of what’s happening south of the border. It’s all “Leave it to us, this is official government business!” A very dangerous attitude indeed when the potential scenario that you’re prepping for is one in which all those official structures may come crumbling down, leaving people to scramble on their own with no forethought or preparation. A recipe for disaster!
Apart from Tree Man in Victoria, do we have any other preppers here from BC?
I don’t know where the Ottawa Citizen got its 1 million prepper statistics but I am guessing that must be happening mostly in Ontario. Certainly not in Alberta. My husband and I went to a workshop put on by the David Thompson Health Region and Red Deer College (the first and only of it’s kind in Alberta), in early March, and I don’t think they even filled 500 seats. Now maybe, most of those preppers are govenment people and some business agencies throughout the country. Everyone I have talked to, my dentist, an RCMP officer who happens to be my neighbour, friends, family, acquaintences, my daugter who works in a medical clinic, none of them have a clue about bird flu. I talked to one lady very recently and she was shocked. She said that last year, there was a bird in her yard that just sat there and didn’t fly away. She went over and PICKED IT UP and showed it to her kids and then put it on a shrub where it flew away. She didn’t know about any bird flu and now realizes that her ignorance could have cost the life of her family, had that bird been sick with H5N1. Needless to say, she won’t be picking up any more birds that don’t fly away. And she will be warning her children. She also has cats. I told her that cats will eat those kinds of birds that don’t fly away, so the cats could bring the disease into her home. Innocent people are in so much danger and they don’t even know it. Our government is in a state of denial. There is no excuse for not telling people. A couple of short messages directing people to an appropriate website, flashed on the TV screen, would be all it would take to alert people to the danger.
Panic Stricken. “A couple of short messages directing people to an appropriate website, flashed on the TV screen, would be all it would take to alert people to the danger”. Of course, I agree with your common sense solution. The problem is regulators can’t on one hand maintain the message of 2 - 7 million worldwide mortallity rate (‘50,000 will die in Canada and we lose that many each year to smoking anyway’)and at the same time say there is a danger. The WHO estimate that I mention was based on a computer simulation with a clear qualification not to be used as an estimate.
Canadian regulators take no responsibility, they have abbrogated all authority to the WHO and when things don’t work out, blaming the WHO will be their fallback strategy.
Anyone know of any supply houses/ warehouses in Canada that you can order supplies from online? Something like nitro-pak.com, but in Canada — (so as not to have to pay to get something over the border!)?
http://www.harvestfoodworks.com/
Ont. based dehydrated food provider. I have not ordered anything from them so don’t know the quality.
Looks good — it’s just food, though… mec.ca has some hard supplies, though I suspect there may be places with a larger selection.
Any other Albertans prepping? I don’t see signs of it when shopping. I make periodic trips down to MEC but I don’t plan to use dehydrated food (I’ve got a few days supply if we need to be in transit). It’s just too pricey for day to day. I’ve gotten bulk at the Wholesale Canadian Superstore such as chickpeas (40 lbs for $24.00 I think, split peas 40 lbs for $12.00 etc.) You have to watch prices but for rice, flour,some beans, oil, and other staples good place to go (not online).
Everyone, checkout http://www.coghlans.com
They’re an outdoor supplier based in Winnipeg. Tons of great emergency supplies. Can’t order online from their website, but can order online through the suppliers they list. All the info on their website.
Avoid customs charges on cross-border ordering!
Also must go to http://www.mec.ca — can order online. Need minimum $150 order if you want free shipping. Must be a member (easy to do! $5 for lifetime).
Actually, you CAN order directly from COGHLAN’S! You just have to call their toll-free number and do it over the phone. Use their catalogue (avail. on their website). You have access to their whole line now, not just the few items a retailer will carry.
Another one to check out is http://www.sirmailorder.ca
I have bought fishing and hunting gear from them and it is pretty rugged stuff. There are no pictures on their web site but you can order a catalogue from the site.
My order from MEC should be coming soon…. I bought my first knife! And a decent compass…. I just put in a small order to start to see how their delivery system is. I plan to make another order.
(compass is for the BoB, in case you’re wondering — and the knife is a hunting/fishing type survival knife).
Cosco has Whey Protein Powder $35-$38 for about 90 servings. It is a high quality protein, you can use, when your meat supplies run out. Just add water and drink. The shelf life is about 3 years. It is also an excellent protein for people who want to build muscle while working out. It is excellent protein supplement for seniors and children too. Think of it! 90 servings could give you a protein serving every day, for 3 months (along with other foods that you have stored). Just make sure you buy the kind that is made in Canada (no growth hormones used for raising the cattle).A good quality whey protein supplement is edible even for people who are lactose intolerant.
Cosco also sells quite a variety of nutritious protein bars. If you don’t mind eating these on occasion (just to keep them cycled and fresh), they will make an interesting meal supplement in pandemic times.
Most camping stores will carry some dehydrated food packages that are good for up to 5 years. I am buying the scrambled egg breakfasts and dehydrated strawberries. (About 10 of each). We can use these up in 5 years on camping trips to keep them fresh. It is always interesting to have some novelty items in your emergency cupboard to keep life interesting when things get really bad.
Ensure (protein drink supplements) are another protein product you can stock, for when meat, cheese, and milk supplies run low.
Of course there are always canned tuna, salmon, etc. and a few canned meats (ham, chicken turkey, beef). It is always easy to stock canned vegatables and fruits, rice, dehyrated potatoes (Cosco has excellent deyhrated pototoes), but I find stocking adequate proteins, and still having variety is more of a challenge. Cosco jams have a shelf life of 5 years.
So, I would have to say, in Canada, my main supplier of pandemic supplies is coming from Cosco.
Does anyone know where to order/buy radios in Canada? Online? Good emergency radios, not el-cheapo radio shack stuff… (though I guess it’s possible they might have a good radio, I don’t trust the knowledge of their representatives)
HI from Toronto (just outside in urban GTA)
I’ve started my prepping and many of my friends and family have too. I am lucky that I work in the university environment (in a hospital that had 2 of the SARS cases) where the threat of pandemic is being taken more seriously.
I have found this forum incredibly valuble for tips and information on prepping. Believe it or not the hospitals (and the university where I work) are starting to cirulate pandemic planning documents.
That’s great, Houghton… how many hospitals are doing that over there? Would be interested to hear updates on any hospital plans especially for Ontario (where I am). Do you know anything about the so-called Ontario healthcare workers mandate? Will retired healthcare workers be pulled back in during a pandemic? We hope not.
ricewiki - This Canadian site has the Freeplay ‘Summit’(The ‘Summit’ model was mentioned in your radio thread) http://www.modernoutpost.com/ Located in B.C. I have not ordered from them so can’t vouch for them specifically…maybe some other Canadian posters here can do so. I am actually looking for the Freeplay ‘Plus’ model…does anyone know if that is available in Canada either online or in stores?
I’m checking out the same thing, Goosebumps… Thanks for the link!
ricewiki. I do not know how to use this computer so I am asking for your assistance in putting an article in News Reports.
If you go to ‘Crofsblog h5n1′ and click on the left-hand list to ‘Bird Flu Today’ and go to the bottom of the page on the right under ‘Disease Control’, there is an article called ‘Global Heat Spreads Diseases’. I think it has real implications to be considered with respect to pandemic bird flu…Thanks.
Just wanted to say hello to my fellow Canadians, especially Prepping Gal and PanicStricken; I am also an Albertan. I’m in Calgary, and nope, not a whiff or a sign of anybody prepping. Tried tossing the idea out to my neighbors, and quickly reverted back into my shell after getting the *kook* look. Its nice to see some Albertans here.
My husband bought a crank radio from radio shack for $50. Crank it up and it plays for at least one hour. He was very impressed. He tried it out and it really works. Cosco sells 2 crank flashlights for $20. They work well too and give a good strong light. Canadian Tire sells a package of 2 glass oil lamps for $18.00.
Hello to you too, Kodos. Welcome aboard! Did you hear, Canada is now having a ‘National Emergency Prepping Week’ to raise awareness among the common folk to prepare for disasters (72 hour prep). Well, it’s a start! Somewhat short-sighted but I guess you have to start somewhere!
Guys, what kind of a site is this? I just came across it…
Looks like it’s just getting set up/ under construction, a bit amateur maybe? Canada’s flu plan is down at the very bottom.
Doesn’t look professional. Smells like a cyber squatter who got the domain name and trying to profit from the pandemic, IMO. Most new entries are chosen to scare the lay person. I won’t be surprised to see more ads in future. May be even fake Tamiflu.
ANON-YYZ That’s funny. I had exactly the same impression but decided not to comment.
Well cybersquatters watch the news and always register new domains…. http://www.whois.net/search.cgi2?str=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pandemic.ca%2F
Specifically, http://whois.cira.ca/public search for ‘pandemic’, reveals pandemic.ca being registered in 2005, changed more recently… http://whois.cira.ca/public?domaine=pandemic.ca&LANGUE=en
I bought my Grundig crank radio (with flashlight built in!!) at Radio Shack in Cobourg (Ont) for abt $50 - Grundig is supposed to be pretty good!! Northumberland Health Unit partnered with County admin has put out an ‘emergency’ booklet - has general info in it but nothing about BF except for an ad placed by some guy who is doing business planning.
Just wanted to say hi to all Canadians, Im on the East Coast in New Brunswick. Thanks PanicStricken for the info on the hand crank radio, i think i’ll do that this afternoon. Also just wondering if any of you saw the Drama Documentary on W5 back in December or maybe even before dec. It was in the BF and what things would be like in Canada if TSHTF. That was when i started prepping. Anyways just touchin base with all you canucks!!!
DonJuans,
no I never saw that. Do you have its title? What station is W5? (I never watch tv!)
Hi, from Calgary, Alberta. I’ve been at this for 10 years… not for the bird flu though, never know when any emergency might strike, loss of husband’s job, disability, etc. In my church, I have the responsibility to help get others prepared, so it’s a work of progress…not always on my mind, but more lately is on it. Having a preparedness fair on June 10, that I got to get ready.
Hi gharris. Thanks for connecting with me on the other thread. I don’t remember a Lex in my year at Guelph. I graduated from BSc Agr. in 1978 and OVC in 1982.
If he’s serious about meeting to talk about avian flu then maybe the three of us can get together at some point in the near future.
Welcome preparedness101. I’m just west of the city and I noticed this week that LDS has a food center down on Farrell Road I think it said. I’m assuming for the moment that you are with LDS. I’ve been the in the family center on 17th for genealogical research years ago. At this point I’m prepared for 12 months depending on whether I end up feeding extended family etc. If I’m right that you are with LDS how do you handle discussions with families that don’t prepare and then expect others to look after them. You’ll see in another thread the issues we are dealing with. I’m sure the church has dealt with this and therefore what’s the general understanding if family, friends, and neighbors choose not to prepare.
Hi! This is my first post although I have been lurking for many months. I am in southwestern Ontario and our local paper has had some bird flu coverage. They gave an overview of the 1918 pandemic and discussed the problems incurred with burial of the bodies etc. Someone wrote a letter to the editor very upset saying “there’s no need to scare us” with these details.
There was a fancy flyer put together about emergency preparedness in the paper this past weekend and they indicated they would have additional coverage this week, but I’ve yet to see it (maybe in this weekend’s edition??).
I have one friend who is prepping, and I have discussed with my parents and they are cautious, but feel comfortable because they have some canned goods and water. They say they’ll come to my house:)
I would be grateful if anyone could enlighten me about solar power options. I am having trouble wrapping my head around the “details”. I would be interested in having a small solar system set up that could recharge a laptop battery and run a toaster oven, when necessary. Is there anything on this page that could do this?? http://tinyurl.com/rlr69
Thanks for all the great information on this site and support!
I learned a lot from fluwikie so time to give some help back.
I bought the 15W panel from canadian tire. It comes with 12V car adapter that also plugs into their powerbox 1200 (on sale till Friday tomorrow for $199). This panel won’t be enough to charge the 1200W powerbox and so I bought a splitter and have 2 panels charging one powerbox.
For laptop, you need to get a auto adapter from the manufacturer, then just plug into the big battery. This powerbox has a 60Amp Hour Absorbent Glass Material sealed battery, comes with an inverter and a built in charger. It was the best deal I could find when on sale.
The 15W panels (5 year warranty) are not rated as well as the 80W panels (I think 20 year warranty) but for emergency use, and for the price, it’s good enough.
The powerbox 1200 is made by Xantrex.
Would not recommend using battery to run toaster oven or any cooking. Solar panel is even less feasible.
Hi from Ottawa, I’ve been slowly getting my stuff together for about 6 months now. Figure I’ll leave the food for last since its going to be easier to get than a camp stove WTSHTF.
TOM DVM - I dont have Lex’s email - but you cd call him Northumberland Vet Prof Corp Colborne - he is the right kind of person to get involved in a County DVM initiative - also the DVM in Pt Hope is public minded (remember the Bewdley dragging incident a couple of years ago?)I am sure there are others!! I would be GLAD to help!! You can find my real name in the current issue of Watershed Magazine - wrote article on Bird Flu with help of family chicken culler Sophie the Newfy!!
Thanks ANON-YYZ!
Kiki, Hi from Manitoba! If you have solar power questions here? is the best place on the wiki to find the answers- Eccles is a power supply genius!
Hope you keep posting!
Prepping Gal - Yes, I’m LDS. I personally have my parents here, and they love preparedness as much as I do, so I shouldn’t need to worry about them, my dad has put together a great resource book of where to go to buy different supplies, and I’m preparing to do a fair to educate the people in my “ward” or boundaries on June 10. Another way, to encourage family or neighbours to prepare perhaps without spending your money all on them, is to perhaps share a garden with them. I like how someone mention to drop off a bucket of food storage goodies! Do I share with my neighbours, others, or even LDS who haven’t prepared? That seems like it could be a tough question, with not wanting to expose others, and risking your own health especially if it’s a flu pandemic. I would want to think like Jesus, what would he do if he was here? Although, at times like this it would be very trying to share, I personally would need to reflect that I too, am dependent on everything that I have been given on this earth. For the proud, I’m sure it will be a humbling experience to come knocking at a door, but to me life goes on after death, and my actions here determine my true character. We should have the attitude, we don’t have to share – we get to share! Of course, one would be rationing food even when you share, and mostly likely could get right down to the last meal to stay alive, but I would then hope that the Lord would remember how we tried our best to keep his commandments, and he would hold his end of the bargain. In a time of crisis, we know their would be others that would break in and steal, but I firmly believe that if I do all that I am asked to do, then the Lord will not abandon me if I’ve kept his commandments.
gharris. Thanks, could you give me his full name.
If we were going to have a meeting, it would be more than appropriate to include Dr. Richard Chavis…I think he is your Regional Medical Officer of Health?
NickTHK
That’s my thinking, too. I’ve got 3mos of non-food preps ready to go, but am waiting a bit more for food… although, I may start this pretty soon the way things are looking.
Just finishing up some year-end stuff before I have time to get out and get more preps…. need to rest my credit cards, too.
gharris. Actually, on second thought, it might make things easier if you e mail me at SuGastle57@aol.com. Thanks
TOM DVM = It is Dr Richard Schabas in Quinte - he was in TO for SARS - he is a naysayer and no help in my opinion!!! HKPR health unit are also no help - been there they are not on our wavelength - However, Cobourg Chamber of Commerce IS aware and wd help - I know some of TPTB there - Luttighuis wd be glad to hear from you - I told him about yr postings here and he was fascinated - and very concerned!
gharris. That is exactly why it would be interesting to talk to Dr. Schabas because he has been bugging me for some time!!!
TOM DVM - sorry - not Quinte but rather Hastings and Prince Edward Cty Health Unit - here is their website http://tinyurl.com/zrrnr
gharris. If you belong to the Newfoundland association that incorporates Peterborough County, you’re in for a chuckle.
preparedness101 Thanks for your response. I hope your fair is successful. The fact that we can look at the same issue “people not preparing” from very different backgrounds and know its an issue without easy answers brings us together in our concern. Of all the prepping I’ve done this is the one that will be resolved I think based on our beliefs and from all our previous experiences that bring us to the pivotal point. We plan to isolate completely but to hand out (at a distance) care packages if someone knocks on our door but not risk infectious contact by allowing anyone in our home. I have comfort in knowing we’ve planned for this event after much thought. Only time will tell.
Hey Ricewiki,. I found the web site the show was called..Black Dawn: The Next Pandemic. It aired on January 11/2006 on the fifth estate on the great CBC. “Black Dawn combines expert opinions with dramatic recreations to paint a starkly realistic picture of life durng the next pandemic.”
Ricewiki, I live downtown and am a couple of blocks away from a half dozen markets that sell 20kg bags of rice, lentils etc,etc. Lets face it most of our fellow citizens dont really pay attention to the international news scene, so I figure I’ve got a minimum 2 week head start on the self absorbed who would never venture downtown in an emergency. My concern is having to cast a wider net to get a few of those hard to find items that only Cantire is going to carry, and you know in an extended emergency you don’t want to be anywhere near that kind of chaos.
Hi to all the Canadians on the site. I also am a long time lurker and have enjoyed this site for many months now and would like to try to give something back to all the people that make this site a success. Ricewiki asked what would be a appropriate one way Radio to purchase for use to gather information durring a Pandemic. I would have two suggestions for AM/FM/SW/single side band radios which are a bit more expensive than the FR-200 and FR-300 Eton/Grundig radios, but Give a bit better reception and are digital tuned. The Radios are the Grundig YB400PE and the Sony ICF-SW7600GR AM/FM Shortwave World Band Receiver with Single Side Band Reception. I have owned the YB400PE for 5 or 6 years and have been very satisfied with it. A friend of mine owns the Sony and has good luck with it as well and it may be slightly more sensitive that the YB400PE but I have not personaly verified this. I use the YB 400PE as my Short Wave Radio and I have a FR-300 Eton as my weather alert and TV channel back up radio durring a power outage. Both radios have AM/FM cpability. I hope this has been of some help.
preparedness101 Would you happen to know if there are any suppliers for the type of hand pumps that are used in the Government camp grounds to manually pump water. I am trying to locate a supplier in Alberta but so far no luck. Thanks in advance
Thanks Sailor. Is the Grundig YB400PE also a SSB receiver? Which of those two is more expensive? And can you order/buy either in Canada?
Don Juans and Nick, Thanks. Sorry I skipped your posts….hard to keep up with all the action here lately…
Nick, we should start a thread for inner-urban preppers if there isn’t one…..very special situation, doncha think?
ricewiki The Grundig YB400PE and the Sony are both SSB and are very comparable in Quality, but as I was mentioning I think the Sony is a Slightly more sensitive radio (will receive weaker signals) based on my friends comments and the reviews that I have read on line. I have not priced the Radios out lately but when I purchased the Grundig it was slightly less expensive than the Sony. If I was to do it again I would give the Sony close consideration. You may be able to find a review on line that compares both radios head to head. They can both be purchased in Canada. I am new to posting on this site so am hesitant to recomend suppliers. Would you know where I can locate the rules as I tried to locate them on the site last night and did not have any luck. Thanks
Sailor – at 08:26
What is the side band for? Thanks.
ANON-YYZ I am not a Ham operator or an expert on Single Side band by any means but I will try to explain what the side band is used for as I understand it. Single Sideband is a method where Ham Radio operators, Maritime radio operators and Aeronautical operators communicate via radio in two way communication. If you have A receiver with Single Side band capability you will be able to listen in on the conversations taking place between these groups of people. The Ham Radio operators often lend assistance in communications as in the case of Hurricanes.
Sailor,
I think it’s generally ok here to say where you bought something (people say Sam’s, Costco etc. all the time) as long as it’s clear you are not affiliated with that company or could profit from the sale.
Everyone:
Are there any reliable online grocery deliverers in Canada? Will any deliver through… post? truck? to some of the smaller towns too?
Also, does anyone know where to buy water storage containers here? Good ones, of a moderate size (1–5 gallon or 4–20 litres?)
If there’s an online place for buying these, all the better.
The used buckets from the supermarket also would work for storing water (maybe a whiff of buttercream frosting in the water would be welcome).
Here are some links to online suppliers in Canada you guys might want to buy from - no I’m not affiliated, but these are some places I’ve bought from. They all deliver.
ricewiki – at 14:01
7 gallon water jugs available from Walmart in Canada in the camping section. 1 jug good for 1 person for 1 week so it’s easiest to inventory. 7 gallons would be a bit heavy. 5 gallon sizes also available, as well as collapsible - not as durable for refill or if you need to move them around. Canadian Tire sells the 5 gallon version.
Do not put the jug directly on cement floor of basement as it is corrosive, especially when wet. It might damage the plastic over time. A 2 ft deep by 4 ft wide shelf holds 8 x 7 gallon jugs (about 448 lbs). Use only the bottom shelf for water as it’s heavy. Use the upper shelves for cans and bulk food (also heavy, but not as bad). I built one with 2×4 lumber (just like a deck) and 1/2 inch plywood. Steel wire shelves available from Home Depot or Costco might work (check the load support).
Anon,
I won’t have major shelving of any sort. Is it safe to put a 5-gallon jug on a piece of plywood perhaps? What else? What about leaving it on a carpet or hardwood floor? I’m just gonna be in a little apartment…
Thanks by the way…. I’ll check out CanTire asap…
Ihad my water jugs (store bought 9 liter jugs) stacked (mistake) on rubber maid containers. Didn’t notice a small leak until it spilled over on to the floor. Now I’ve place my jugs on a piece of carpet (not stacked) & now I can see if any leak occurs by a wet carpet stain.
Another question: I may be moving to the U.S. and I’m wondering if I can bring my food preps over the border.
Would I have to pay duty? Would they confiscate them? I tried reading through some customs websites but it’s not clear — they just have info on americans going back to america, or Canadians coming back to Canada.
BTW, none of these food preps contain animal meat, seeds, birds, fruit or citrus stuff — it seems that’s what they’re most worried about. I just have dried stuff and cans.
ricewiki – at 18:50
Corrosion problem only if you have cement floor. So you should be fine in apartment. There was some general health department recommendation about storing food at least a few inches above floor (same level as your bottom kitchen drawer). It might have been mentioned on the wiki. Someone mentioned getting a used pallet (for shipping). I wouldn’t do that - don’t know what insects might be in the wood, which country it was from.
ricewiki The YB400PE can be bought at “The Source” (the old Radio Shack) and the Sony can be bought at the “Sony Store. I was doing a bit more thinking on this and for what it is worth if you are wanting to keep informed as to what is happening in the world the short wave and AM/FM are what you need to Monitor. If you wish to monetor what is happening in your area you may want to add a Scanner to your collection as it will monetor action by the local Police,Ambulance,Fire Dept,County Employees etc. If you want to monitor incoming storms you need the radio which has weather alert capability. In Short there is no easy answer and to cover all the bases you need three different Radios. In addition I would ensure they are all capable of being operated off 12V to 9V etc. addaptors and have a solar panel capable of charging up the 12V battery. Then you will truly have all the basis covered as far as radios go.
How come nobody is mentioning the big news from Ottawa today?? http://tinyurl.com/nk9fn Uncles Steve & Tony promise that every sick Cdn will get antivirals!! Aint that great??!!! Now - just tell me again - how do I get them if I am SIP and the hospital is the worst place to go??
That is some positive news (if only still a promise in the sky). What about Canadians currently abroad? Or abroad during the pandemic, or when they get sick? will they receive antivirals? oh dear…..
gharris - Maybe a drive thru at Tim Hortons (like the special 25 cent piece distributed by them) can handle both caffiene and anti-viral needs. No connection to the company. Are they still a Canadian company?
Thanks Anon YYZ at 23:59 - I have been out at a VERY smart dinner party and just got in and online!! Didnt see it elsewhere - sorry!!
gharris,
did you guys talk about BF?
A bit - my fave topic!! One woman there is HCW and thinks we can rely on the antivirals - the host thinks she still has stuff leftover from Y2K - :-)) at least it wasnt on the table!! Otherwise the other 6 guests were fairly bored with the topic! Bronco Bill’s remedy in good supply tho’ so not entirely wasted evening!!
gharris – at 00:10
No Problem. Hope you had a good time.
BTW, did I disappoint you with the link? “No shortage” is just fairy tale…
Back to prep.
Anon YYZ - link was great - thank you!! I think I am seriously in love with Anon-22 - he is just SO brilliant!!
gharris, anon_22 is a lady:-) you’re right about the brilliant though.
I just KNEW someone would tell me that right after I posted!!! oh well. . . best not to be narrowminded!!! Must be BroncoBills remedy gone to me ‘ead!! I think you ALL are SO brilliant!!
Water -I too, Love the relaince brand available at Wal-mart. I’ve learned from experience that you shouldn’t stack more than two high or they bulge and they leak! They also are covered under warranty and you can get them replaced, if you hang onto your receipt. I then, use “aerobic oxygen” to keep anything else to grow in the water, and prevents me from having to change the water every year. You can buy aerobic oxygen through http://www.goodforyou.ca The aerobic oxygen is comes in a 2oz bottle for $20 or $15, if you buy a membership (it’s cheap, and lasts forever, and one 2 oz bottle can do 45 galloons of water.
Some like the drums: if you’re not planning to move it… 45 gallon, with a tight fitting lid with two openings on top retails at $87 or an open lid for $94 through the Calgary or there are other sites in the County at http://www.gwcontainers.com Sailor, I see they carry some kind of pump to attach to this drums, but I’m not sure if this is what you are looking for, are you looking for a specific pump to attach to a well? Have you tried doing a general search online?
My other favourites are:
First Aid Supplies, need to order large supplies in Calgary- Vereburn 2235 27 Ave NE, 250–7944 http://www.pacsafety.com/products/ems_dealer.htm
http://www.dri-harvest.com/ Based in Sherwood Park, Edmonton, here you can get butter powder, spaghetti sauce, pear flakes etc in #10 cans. The fellow used to deliver down to Calgary, I haven’t ordered for about 5 years, but who knows if that still is the case with the way gas prices are.
Another great place to order bulk food is at: http://www.dan-d-pak.com based out of Richmond, B.C, it might be worth splitting an order with a neighbour!
preparedness101 Thanks for the information on the pump but the one that I am looking for is the Hand Pump used in the Provincial parks to pump water by the people camping in the Park. I have located a supplyer in the states which makes a good looking pump made of stainless steel but would like to see if I can purchase the one used in the Parks made out of cast steel which should be much less expensive.
Sailor - do you have a website for the supplier in the states, then I can see…as I not much of a camper in a Provincial park!
preparedness101 Here is the site for the Hand operated water pump http://www.solar4power.com/solar-power-water-pump.html Thank you so much for the links at 02:29 very helpfull
Have any Canadians here lived in the U.S. for any period of time? Just wondering if I could ask a few questions unrelated to bird flu (about day-to-day U.S./Canadian banking)… if so pls email me ricewiki at hotmail dot com
Does anyone have a Canadian source for Dermabond (the skin glue made by Johnson & Johnson that can be used instead of sutures for small cuts)?
Is there a good source of masks in Canada - Id like to buy 100 masks or so. If you ordered your maks from the US, did you have any problems with customs, duties, etc.?
From today’s “National Post” for any who haven’t heard this:
“Federal and provincial health ministers met this past weekend to co-ordinate their pandemic planning, agreeing among other things to boost Canada’s national stockpile of the anti-viral drug Tamiflu to 55 million doses, from 16 million.
“The Conservative government’s first budget, unveiled this month, devoted $1-billion over five years to pandemic readiness, compared with $250-million for a new cancer-control strategy. Governments at every level have released pandemic plans that predict as many as 58,000 Canadians killed.”
Good luck, Canucks! Looks like you and your officials are on the ball as much or more than any worldwide!
Sailor, I was just on Ebay in the” Antiques/garden” section and there are a ton of cast iron hand pumps. And some of them are selling at great prices.
TCat
You can purchase 3M N95 masks in boxes of 20 at Acklands if you can use a company name as they wholesale.
TCat, Sailor. There is nothing at the moment to restrict the sale of N 95 masks at the retail level.
I would try Home Depot or a Home Hardware store. I have found with Home Hardware that if they don’t have it they will order it in.
A third option would be any retail medical supply store.
You shouldn’t have any problem finding them. Best of Luck.
DonJuansOtherDaughter
Thank you for the suggestion, I checked and they have lots of the small cistren type pumps but what I am looking for is the larger model about 4 ft. high that is used in some of the Canadian provincial parks.
Source: Ottawa: Pandemic Information
Pandemics have occurred three to four times each century. The World Health Organization (WHO) has noted that we are in Pandemic Alert, Phase 3 because of the risk that the avian influenza virus could change to become infectious in humans. Nobody knows exactly when this could happen, but scientists from the WHO are watching it closely.
As a society we have become unfamiliar with infectious outbreaks. To protect ourselves we need to learn how influenza is spread and make plans to minimize our risk.
Information is available for:
Learn more about how Ottawa is preparing for an influenza pandemic.
The Government of Canada has provided a central website discussing pandemic, avian and seasonal influenza information from its departments and agencies. The site also includes Canada’s pandemic influenza plan, provincial, municipal and international information and public health measures to protect Canadians.
They also have a contest to win a $100 gift certificate. In order to win, you have to read up about what to do and how to prepare. Seems like a good idea.
European.
It’s easy to have a plan…it’s also easy to boast about how good your plan is (spin) …the ‘proof is in the pudding’ when the time comes.
It’s easy to have a plan to vaccinate every citizen…it’s easy to boast that no other country can do this…particularly interesting is that at the moment there is not an effective vaccine and most attempts at one have been a dismal failure.
Canada is today, much like other countries…what you see and hear is not always what you get.
Tom DVM,
It wasn’t the plan that I thought was important (and you are absolutely right about that). It was the competition. I thought that was a very good idea. :-)
European. I suppose but if a citizen is motivated enough to find a pandemic site, do they really need the added incentive of a 100 reward for reading the information.
Governments and agencies have taken the view that we, the citizens, can’t be told the truth, can’t handle the truth…
…this gift certificate is further evidence of the fact and insults the intelligence of all Canadians…in my opinion.
I have always found that when you respect people enough to take the time to explain the truth and blame yourself and fix the explanation when it is confusing…you get back only respect and gratitude…because you are demonstrating respect for the listener.
Tom DVM- ‘Canada is today, much like other countries…what you see and hear is not always what you get.’
Absolutely. It’s lovely that our goverment has promised antivirals and eventually vaccine for all of it’s citizens…lovely until you take the blinders off and look at the facts.
Even with the promised increase of anti-virals to be available for use in the event of a pandemic there is no way each and every Canadian can be treated as needed. First, it’s not enough. Secondly, how will they distribute it? No ‘plan’ announced on that score.
Vaccines won’t be available for a long time after a pandemic begins, for anybody anywhere. Not unless an effective multi-strain vaccine is developed. I know many people are trying, but there is certainly no assurance of success.
The Canadian goverment could do some real good if it encouraged communities and individual families to prepare for themselves- food, water, maintenance meds, etc. Instead they choose to be hyper-focused on the Tamiflu/vaccine front, important to consider yes- but not the end of the story. I don’t care how much Tamiflu you have, it won’t save you from dehydration or starvation and it won’t replace heart meds or insulin.
Having said that, thank-you European for sharing this info with us ‘Canucks’- no desire here to shoot the messenger:-)
Health care spinning is it’s own industry now, funded of course by health care budget.
Tom DVM …’this gift certificate is further evidence of the fact and insults the intelligence of all Canadians…in my opinion.’
Yes, it is no doubt going to be effective for some people- but consider where the money comes from- your tax dollars and mine. Kinda puts a different light on things doesn’t it?
MaMa. I couldn’t agree with you more and yes, European is one of many highly ethical contributors to flu wiki. I appreciate the effort to put the information here; it is the message that I have a problem with.
MaMa. In my opinion and it’s just my opinion…the gift certificate is an insult…the equivalent of patting one on the head…the equivalent of saying now don’t you worry your little head over the matter.
Empty assurances and gift certificates…they are still convinced that a pandemic is not going to happen so they can say anything they want…while on the otherhand I am convinced we will have a pandemic within a year and would suggest that they will be held to account for their promises.
Like you said…the solution is a community solution…and all the government has to do is to facilitate and fund local solutions.
I can visualize a pandemic without vaccine or effective antivirals or a fully functioning healthcare system…because that will be the way it is…but I cannot visualize a pandemic without any broad spectrum antibiotics, oral electrolytes, prednisolone and anti-fever medications.
I do not want to be put in a situation where there is absolutely nothing we can do to help children.
Tom DVM, yes European is a fine individual who contributes much to the wiki. It’s our goverment that’s got my blood pressure up (and I usually have low blood pressure:-)
‘Empty assurances and gift certificates…they are still convinced that a pandemic is not going to happen so they can say anything they want…’
Essentially that is what they are saying. I wrote to the Deputy Health Minister a little while ago about several issues, but primarily the following concerns:
-my community leaders were not planning, despite numerous attempts on my part- they had not even seen the guidelines available on the internet for municipalities.
-with very few exceptions, no-one that I knew was preparing for themselves.
-there was virtually nothing useful in the media to encourage people to care for themselves.
-there was no ‘call to prepare’ to provinces, cities and municipalities from the federal goverment.
I asked that the goverment visibly and publicly urge communities and individuals to do what they could to prepare for a pandemic, whenever it might occur. Perhaps a few press conferences.
My response was this…Regarding the second part of your e-mail on pandemic preparedness at individual and community levels, an influenza pandemic will have an impact on multiple communities across Canada simultaneously. Therefore, every jurisdiction is working to prepare to respond to such a potential event. We recognize that it is important to co-ordinate the planning and preparation at all levels from the local, to the provincial, to the national level. At the national level, a Canadian pandemic influenza plan has been developed in collaboration with provinces and territories and was released Feb. 2004. The plan which is currently being updated, encourages pandemic planning at all levels and provides some guidance on how to proceed. Most provinces have developed a provincial plan and some cities have created pandemic planning committees as well as their own pandemic plans as part of their preparedness for such an event. With respect to your own community and what is in place, I encourage you to contact your regional office to find out what is being done and see how you might be able to contribute to pandemic preparedness planning.
Regarding your suggestions on how individuals can prepare for an influenza pandemic, it is important to keep in mind that no one knows when it will occur. Stockpiling food and other essentials would be premature until there are some clear signs that an influenza pandemic has emerged such as confirmed, sustained human to human transmission of the virus in some part of the world. When this happens, the federal, provincial and territorial communication network that has been created to co-ordinate all pandemic messages across the country, will provide information to Canadians, including measures that they can take at the individual level.
Once again, thank-you for writing.
Political-speak translation: don’t worry, your goverment will take good care of you if anything bad happens…
Realism translation: if you don’t do for yourself, despite our promises and assurances- you’re screwed.
Interesting discussion, and very important. To me, as a complete outsider, the important issue at the moment is to raise public awareness - by whatever means one can find. The more people that are aware of the pandemic threat, the more chance we have of being prepared for the big one, when it comes.
Tom, I believe you are correct in that community isolation as the best solution, and that is has to be facilitated by the authorities. But with few people really aware of the issue it does not come far up on the political agenda. In Europe the general public has been totally passified - the politicos are actively surpressing any prepping talk IMHO. You still have a chance. So find mechanisms to get people aware.
MaMa – at 11:27
“Stockpiling food and other essentials would be premature until there are some clear signs that an influenza pandemic has emerged such as confirmed, sustained human to human transmission of the virus in some part of the world. When this happens, the federal, provincial and territorial communication network that has been created to co-ordinate all pandemic messages across the country, will provide information to Canadians, including measures that they can take at the individual level.”
So when WHO has confirmed, sustained human to human transmission, the government will tell you it’s time to rush to the supermarket and stock up at the individual level.
Now would the supermarket chain get the news first, or would the riot police get the news first?
Answer, the fluwikian gets the news first.
ANON-YYZ, I’m sure fluwikians would know first:-)
The problem is all of the people who have bought into this lock stock and barrel. How well will we fare as communities if only one out of 10 homes has more than a few days of groceries? If ‘all of a sudden’ the water supply is not functional? Supermarket shelves could be empty in a day or two and if disruption in the supply chain is as severe as some of us fear it could be- when will more food and supplies arrive. I’d rather my neighbor have food to eat, than I am forced to chose between helping them out and feeding my children.
On the essential services front, my husband will be on the front lines in a pandemic(firefighter with EMT training). What is our local goverment doing to plan for his safety and well-being while he risks his life to help others?…zip. No stockpile of masks or gloves or alternate accomodations, etc. No updated emergency plan tailored for pandemic. The names on the last emergency plan have some co-ordinators/officers who are deceased now- last updated about 1991.
There are hundreds of thousands of people who are ready to serve their communities, in the same boat. It’s a damned crime IMO.
MaMa European AnonXYZ. Thanks for the comments.
European. Governments are spinning the ‘don’t worry be happy argument’ because they are convinced it’s not going to happen…where could they possibly get that idea? Well, since Jan 2005, the WHO has been spinning the same message six ways to Sunday, including using falsified data (2–7 million moratality from a pandemic and we lose that many to smoking each year anyway). Why are they doing it? Because they are ‘smoking the same dope they are supposed to be selling…they have bought the story…a pandemic is not going to happen.
Regulatory agencies are most interested in removing as much agency responsibility as possible. The WHO has provided the excuse for the continuance of the message and someone to blame if, in fact, we get a pandemic.
The bottom line is that H5N1 vaccines have been an abysmal failure and influenza vaccines in general are an abysmal failure…and even if they weren’t they won’t be avaliable to the general public for two years given the increased dosages required.
The primitive anti-virals won’t work either. In both cases, when faced by repeated failures we get the one message indicative of failure in both cases, increase the dose rate or use the increased dose rate in combination with other treatments or amplifiers in the case of vaccine. The increased dose of antivirals now required virtually erases stockpiles (good for the company) and still there has been no discussion of serious nervous system side-effects.
I don’t think they realize that either there will be no pandemic at all or the pandemic will be much worse (mortality rates) than 1918…and like anon said, what will our populations do if hungry, with questionable supplies of electricity, heat, and hot water. Now, complicate that with a situation in which we have sick children in bed and nothing to treat them with…if this is not a definition of anarchy, I don’t know what would be.
They had better get off the dope and start thinking realistically… in a hurry because we are going to have the answer, one way or another, in a very short period of time.
They and We are going to pay a terrible price for their empty promises.
MaMa – at 12:06
“It’s a damned crime IMO.”
Crime it is. Crime against humanity.
If TSHTF and the public wants to go after the officials, that should be the charge. It won’t just be another election, if you live to see it.
Mr. Politician and Mr. Spin Doctor, you heard it here first.
Sorry, I forgot to put the potential of a pandemic in an additional context.
Okay, so let’s say for arguement that there is a twenty percent probability of a pandemic with losses greater than 1918 in the next seven years…so I would ask…name one other threat that could wipe out at least one-fifth of the world’s population in twelve months…a world war wouldn’t do it. The only analogy that might suffice would be a nuclear armageddon or a large meteor etc. hitting the earth.
The losses in Canada could be more than 6 million deaths. I believe we lost 50,000 lives in the lCanadian armies of both great wars.
The point I’m trying to make is that Canada was placed on a war footing twice in the last century. Why wouldn’t this threat require at least a similar concentrated effort…the potential consequences and outcomes far out weigh those of either world war.
ANON-YYZ, couldn’t have said it better myself. I don’t know how they sleep at night.
Tom DVM- ‘Canada was placed on a war footing twice in the last century. Why wouldn’t this threat require at least a similar concentrated effort…the potential consequences and outcomes far out weigh those of either world war.’
IMO it should require a greater effort. In war, the best and brightest of our young adult men and women are sacrificed for the sake of peace and freedom for all. With this, if it happens and is severe, not only them but our young children- our future will be sacrificed as well. For the sake of stupidity.
MaMa You would make a great Member of Parliament.
Tom DVM,
That is probably the best argument I have heard so far about the whole BF issue.
And, you do not need to sell me on the worst case scenario, I am even more pessimistic than you, and on top of that I live in London. :-)
European. I hereby make you an honourary citizen of Canada…Welcome!!!
Thanks Tom DVM,
I love Canada. Only been to the west coast though. Skiing in Whistler a few times. Looks a lot like west coast on Norway.
Tom DVM, thanks. That’s one of the nicest things anyone has ever said to me.
Sailor, Tom DVM - Thanks for the reply
I am new to prepping and information on masks is the most confusing to me at the moment. From the information on this site, I’ve figured I have to buy at least 10 masks per person - one for each day of the week + few more. I’ve checked Shoppers Drug Mart and Home Depot - both had ‘woodworking’ for about $6-$7 for 2 masks.
This what Home Depot had: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00004Z4D4/102-8475578-8179362?v=glance&n=228013
I want to get at least 100 masks so I am looking at $350 and I am not even sure if these masks are good enough.
Did anyone get their masks from MasksNMore? http://www.masksnmore.com/3m18hecapare.html
anon at 13:25, I got masks from MasksNMore. They were easy to order from, came in about a week. Use FedEx or you might get a 6 week lag while your package vacations in customs. It costs more, but it’s worth it IMO.
I ordered the 1860 and 1860S masks. They were relatively economical and had a good rating. I didn’t order alot for the family as we plan to isolate long term. I ordered quite a few for my hubby to use while working. This company offers a N95 sampler pack and a fit testing kit- I would recommend you try that first before ordering quantities of any product. That way you know what will work best for yourself and your family. Proper fit is essential for maximum safety, or so I’m told.
Just called Vereburn a First AId Medical Supplier here in Calgary. It’s a great place to get a really good first aid items like steri-strips, etc…the have a P95, it’s called the Verasheild, and claims it will kill the virus, as it has an inner liner. $12.95 each! $120/box of 10. I never though to ask if they are reusuable for that price!
Just called Vereburn a First AId Medical Supplier here in Calgary. It’s a great place to get a really good first aid items like steri-strips, etc…the have a P95, it’s called the Verasheild, and claims it will kill the virus, as it has an inner liner. $12.95 each! $120/box of 10. I never though to ask if they are reusuable for that price!
Everybody,
Check out Microbix for buying masks. They’re located in Toronto and can ship without customs fees etc. You can buy online, they have huge catalogues (will mail to you for free) full of masks and virus protection supplies, since they are a virology/biochemistry/vaccine production company.
MaMa – at 13:36 Sampler pack of masks? I should mention it to my family, just to see how hard they’d laugh at me.
I think that purchase of masks is important – they might disappear quickly if something comes up.
Ricewiki, prices are good on microbix, but 8210 mask is the mask I saw at Home Depot. I keep thinking that we need ‘health care’ quality masks. I did not see 3M 1860 on the web site - will order their catalog to see the full selection.
I understand we are OK with reusing disposable masks, as long as we wait at least 48 hours before re-using them, right?
TCat
I’ve never heard anything about being able to reuse disposable masks… would be good to know for sure.
Ricewiki et al. I have used a set of hepa filters on a half-face mask for more than a week without problems. As far as the fit on an N95 mask goes, it is just a matter of adusting the nose piece…it’s not that big a deal to get a good seal… just a matter of common sense.
As far as re-using the mask goes, it probably comes down to how you handle the mask with your fingers when using. The virus likes moist conditions so as long as you take reasonable care and make sure the mask dries out, I don’t see why it wouldn’t last a week or more.
TCat, ‘MaMa – at 13:36 Sampler pack of masks? I should mention it to my family, just to see how hard they’d laugh at me.’
I can tell you mine were seriously amused:-)
Seriously though, there are some differences between the different styles and with a sample pack you can buy a couple of several kinds and fit-test them before ordering a significant amount of them to see which works best with your face shape and size. For instance, if I hadn’t done that I would have ordered all large, as that appears to be the standard for most adults. I had to get some of the small for my Mom (she’s tiny!) and my almost-teen children and nephews. I’m not too flush, so I like to think BEFORE I spend a big chunk of money.
ricewiki, thank-you for the link to a Canadian source! I don’t like to deal with customs unless I have to. If we end up needing more I’ll be sure to get them from there.
Shop local, it pays:-)
Mama If I couldn’t get N 95 masks I would have no problem using cotton masks and trusting them…I don’t think they were quite as backward or dumb in 1918 as others imply. I think the cloth masks worked.
Sorry, I forgot to say that you are absolutely right about sizing and thanks for mentioning it. It often surprises as to which persons require a bigger or smaller size…check first as you said…that will remove the biggest problem with air leakage…using a mask of the wrong size.
Tom DVM, we’re going to use some cotton masks too(if we ever have to use them, I fervently hope not!). DemFromCT posted a link a few weeks ago to a mask pattern that you could make yourself, I’ll see if I can find it in a timely fashion and post here. Anyway, I’m going to make some of them for us to use if we run out of the others. After I’ve made some of the adult size, I’m going to try scaling it down for the ‘wee’ people in our family. I couldn’t find good disposable ones for the really little guys in our family group and I just cannot afford the respirators that you can get in those sizes. I can make my own patterns for clothing, so I have high hopes of being able to figure out how to do this accurately.
From what I’ve read about using the cloth masks in 1918, there was a significant decrease in infection rates where they were used. I think they’d work well, especially if they were just for use when you had to go out for some reason but you weren’t in close physical contact with an infected individual(like nursing them). They would be so inexpensive to have on hand and would have the benefit of being re-usable: just bleach them, rinse and dry. I’m going to try it anyway.
If you can’t find the radio you want at The Source or Future Shop or wherever, try http://www.radioworld.ca
Apparently they are Canada’s leading amateur radio seller - can order online too. Have most of the Grundig line.
MaMa. Influenza viruses are very labile…are very sensitive to environmental changes. I would think washing them in soap in a washing machine would kill any viruses present but bleach plus soap would definitely kill them as well.
Having used both types of masks, I believe that the cloth masks are easier to breathe through and the kids might find the cloth masks easier to use…a mask removed by a child when you are not looking isn’t very effective.
What do you think guys, we might need a “Canadian Preppers 2″ thread soon…. just like those Aussies:)
Tom DVM, excellent point. A mask does no good whatsoever if used incorrectly. The cloth masks would have to be easier to breathe through I think. I tried walking up and down my stairs briskly a few dozen times wearing one of the N95 masks and it was especially hard to breathe through them when exerting yourself. Then again, maybe I’m not in as good shape as I thought I was:-)
ricewiki, whenever you’re ready O’ threadmaster:-)
Joking aside, thanks for being such a positive and active force for clear and organized communication on the wiki- you do an amazing job!
Tom DVM, et al…you might already know this but I really should have added earlier that you should get a pair of goggles for everyone to go with the masks, again a pair that fits well.
Thanks MaMa - I try to contribute where I think I can.
I’ll put together all of our links to Canadian online suppliers and then I’ll start the next thread with them altogether for newbies and easier reading.
you’re welcome!
Great idea for the start of the new thread, that’s just the kind of thing that I meant:-)
If anyone finds a place where I can buy the Sony ICF-SW7600GR AM/FM Shortwave World Band Receiver with Single Side Band Reception in Canada, online or in person, I would love to know. It’s $199 USD, but it has everything, plus SSB reception for listening to HAMs.
Will The Source order in single items like this?
Thanks in advance…
for that matter… if you see any radio with SSB capability for sale in Canada, I’d love to know.
In British Columbia…. use www.gutz.com for medical supplies. I use them for the bulk of medical supplies purchased by our Fire Dept. I’ve never been disappointed yet.