Finally something happening in Michigan. Today is the first of three initial meetings/conferences on Avian Influenza.
“In response to growing concerns about local and state readiness regarding the Avian Influenza House Republican Reps. Ed Gaffney & Neal Nitz announced joint committee meetings between the House Health Policy committee and the House Agriculture committee on preparedness strategies. “We want to talk to people from the state departments as well as local on the ground. In order to ensure that we have the most effective plan we need to have input from as many people as possible” .
Dates and locations: 1) Monday January 30 at 3:00 PM at the Eberhard Center, room 215, on the downtown Grand Rapids campus of Grand Valley State University. 2) Monday February 6 at 10:30 AM at St. John Hospital & Medical Center, Medical Conference Room 390, in the Mack Office Building Detroit. 3) Tuesday February 14 at 10:30 AM in the House Appropriations room in Lansing.
Mid Michigan environmental services lady says she is going on the 14th.I asked her why wait but apparently she has a food borne issue in the area she is working on.She is probably going to regret giving me her cell number but too bad…
Michigan has purchased 36,000 doses of tamiflu. and I have read the plan on how it will be stored, shipped and transported by armed escort to whatever outbreak area we happen to have in the state. But then….. as I recall when I was a working Paramedic in Ann Arbor that there were aprox. 27,000 licensed EMT/Paramedics in the state. (1990′s)I’m not sure how many Cops, or Fire Fighters there are. But we also have a population of ten million. So, who will get the tamiflu? First responders? or sick citizens whose tax dollars paid for the 36,000 doses. Now, about a month ago, I asked my local pharmacist if she was getting alot of questions about tamiflu. She said a couple of people had asked about it. I asked her if she thought she had an adequate supply on hand. She responded that since it had been available for about three years, and very few people ever asked for it, and she had some sitting on her shelf waiting to expire,….. that yes, she had plenty. My concern is more with my employer. Does the Corporation have a plan for how we are going to run the store with a third of the employees sick, a third dead, (worst case, paramedics tend to think that way.)and a third too scared to come to work and be around all the sick ones that have to work to feed themselves. I havent seen anything on the web to show that “The Company” is preparing in any way other than mounting a PR campaign to re-assure the sheep that eating our food will not kill you.(with the bird flu)
Well, I attended that first meeting, and now plan to attend the ones next week and the week after. At this meeting the main focus was on the poultry industry and its current bio-containment. It seems like they are on top of things (have been for several years now) and have a working plan in place. Several things I picked up on. (1)The poultry industry is very concerned about the potential for this to severely damage their business and are preparing a educational campaign to dispel the “media created myths” on the Bird Flu. (2) All the talk at this meeting was centered on a possible pandemic entering the US population through our own poultry industry (both commercial and ‘back-yard’ flocks) and the systems in place for early detection and containment. There was no mention at all of the virus entering the country by way of human carriers of an H2H virus, though in fairness a couple things were said that lends me to believe that will be the topic of discussion at one or both of the next scheduled meetings.
The state reps from the health department were there and gave the most encouraging testimony, they seemed to understand the risk and potential and much of the planning they spoke of centered on different containment measures such as quarantine. Their hand out had a number of pointed statements such as “Serious infectious disease – specifically an Avian Influenza Pandemic – will effect national security and the global economy”, “The dire predictions related to an Avian Influenza Pandemic will only be mitigated and controlled via a strong and responsible public health system”, etc.
Apparently Michigan does have a written plan available since summer 2005
http://www.michigan.gov/mdch/0,1607,7-132-2945_21919_25536-72730--,00.html
With an updated version (version 2.2) consisting of 105 pages just made available in January 2006
http://www.michigan.gov/documents/Pandemic_v2_146401_7.2_0.19_.pdf
I intend to spend some time tonight reviewing these documents. All-in-all, encouraging.
Well I to am glad at least something is happening. I fear from the blurb on the evening news that the focus is going to be how to mitagate the economic damage. Again I heard those familuar words “dont panic” and “chicken is safe to eat” nothing on preparing for the long haul. Im begining to wish they would say OK get your butts out there and stock up for months - or panic EEKS!
Keep us informed
Well, I attended Monday’s meeting in Detroit. The first meeting here in Grand Rapids focused on the poultry industry and their preparedness and response plan, this second meeting focused on the Public Health industry, hospitals, etc. The meeting next week in Lansing on Tuesday February 14 is supposed to focus on the other sectors of society, businesses, organizations and individuals. I just sent an email off to each member of the joint committee voicing my concerns & asking a number of specific questions and asking for them to respond to those at this next meeting. In my letter I encouraged them (and posted links) to visit fluwikie and also directed them to Dr. Osterholm’s report.
http://www.cmc-amman.gov.jo/Preparing%20for%20the%20Next%20Pandemic.doc
Now we’ll just wait and see. So far, in the first two meetings, the state Health Department representatives seemed to grasp the seriousness of the whole thing, I just hope the members of the committee (who are in position to actually act and do something) are becoming more aware as well.
WOW I only sent that email out 40 minutes ago and have already received two phome calls and 4 email responses from the State Representatives offices, and actual repsonses too not an automated one.
No way your kidding they actually responded Im shocked. Who responded - I want to make sure they get my vote!! If you could would you post the Email addys of the members Id like to add my concerns and questions.
EOD—Can you tell us what you have asked and how they responded? ty
hi, i am new and also from the mid-michigan area. that thing back in january that they were working on was a restaurant. a worker made over 200 people sick in one weekend from giving them their stomach flu. ironic isn’t it? i am trying to talk to our local officals and am getting nowhere.
The email responses I received though not auto generated did not specifically address any of the issue or questions I asked, they were more of a thank you for attending the meetings, you are the first person from the general business community to contacts us, thank you for your observations and for voicing your concerns, etc., etc. One of the two phone calls was of the same nature; the other call was much more of an exchange of ideas and concerns. That particular Representative told me there was great concern in the state government of public overreaction and panic unless they controlled the release of information. The condensed version of what she told me was that she knew for certain that certain segments of the population in her district (at least)would be in the streets rioting and looting TODAY unless public announcements were kept low key and given out a little at a time. As has been stated on other threads, learning, acceptance & understanding comes in little jumps and leaps, I am seeing this is true with our public officials as well. There is currently a concern strong enough to act upon but a lack of acceptance that this is an immediate & gravely serious threat.
Here is the link for the Michigan House Health Policy Committee. It lists the committee members and by clicking on each name you are redirected to their individual web sites that have email addresses.
http://house.michigan.gov/committeeinfo.asp?lstcommittees=Health%20Policy
Here is the link for the Michigan House Agriculture Committee.
http://house.michigan.gov/committeeinfo.asp?lstcommittees=Agriculture
The meetings are a joint effort combining both committees. At both meetings Representative Nitz has acted as chair.
Some have asked what questions I posed, in the next post I’ll just cut & paste from my email so you can see those. To make sure I was listened to I tried to point out the gravity of the situation but also not appear as a raving lunatic waving an end of the world sign.
Not sure how this will appear when posted, probably with the format all messed up, but nothing I cAn do about that I guess.
I live in Michigan work for an organization in Grand Rapids called Mel Trotter Ministries. http://www.meltrotter.org/ Mel Trotter is a faith based homeless shelter and substance abuse treatment facility. My interest in this began with a conversation with a friend and started as a personal interest but then quickly incorporated a business interest as well. In my position as Food Service Director I have a great deal of contact with the homeless of our community and therein lies some of my concerns. I see the Avian Influenza as presenting a real challenge to organizations such as Mel Trotter in maintaining operations and insuring a continuance of services in a Pandemic situation. On any given night in Michigan there are over 30,000 people who find themselves homeless. Of that number some 10,000 may be in shelters, many others on the streets, in cars, etc. http://www.mihomeless.org Due to life style, this segment of our population is particularly susceptible to any type of infectious pandemic; their immune systems are often severely compromised, they have no place to quarantine themselves to, they have no food supplies nor anyone capable of providing care. Also, they tend to avoid treatment of health issues and when they do seek treatment their only recourse is an emergency room. If the virus were to get a foot hold in this group of people, they alone would overwhelm our hospitals.
I am not a health care professional and so am unable to provide input or ask questions at the joint committee meetings, however I would like to make a few observations and then pose several questions. Will you please respond to these concerns and questions at the meeting on February 13, 2005 in Lansing?
1) Many comparisons are being made between the virus that caused the 1918 pandemic and H5N1. In fact, most of the models being used today to predict the course and extent of the next pandemic are simply an extrapolation of those figures. The SARS epidemic has also been used to establish some comparison. Combined those figures paint a frightening enough picture but are they sufficient?
a. SARS is less easily transmitted than influenza, it has a longer time (about 3 times?) between “generations” of new cases, it is not contagious before symptoms, and it was only controlled by extreme efforts by the cities and countries involved. The numbers of reported cases and resulting deaths were miniscule in comparison to any influenza pandemic yet the effect it had on economies and businesses was enormous.
b. H5N1 is much more virulent than seasonal influenza. Iwas going to repair this to fix sidescroll but it’s a dead link - pogge
c. Unlike SARS, H5N1 is contagious long before symptoms occur, even longer than “common” influenza. Please note some of the specifics of the Bird Flu in this article from the New England Journal of medicine. Particularity the longer incubation period with upper limits as high as 8 to 17 days. This alone should give concern to the potential speed and extent of transmission that this particular virus presents. http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/353/13/1374
2) Our culture and society today are very different from that of 1918 and many of those differences may increase the danger rather than lessen it. a. In 1918 much of the population (80%) lived in rural settings and only 20% lived in cities; today that figure is almost reversed. WHO has acknowledged that this fact greatly affected the ease of quarantine in 1918. Won’t today’s population figures make it almost impossible to effectively quarantine large numbers of people today? b. In 1918 most of the people grew and stored their own food. Today most people have no more than a couple weeks of food in their home and most who live in the cities have no more than a couple of meals. c. Transportation in 1918 was much slower and far fewer people traveled much beyond their own town or county. Today over 10,000,000 people cross international borders every single day. In the US alone last year more than 680,000,000 people flew on domestic flights, that’s over 1,863,000 per day. d. The people of 1918 were much more self sufficient and self reliant than today. Look at Katrina where a large segment of the population did nothing other than wait for someone to come to their aid. e. The U.S. population is also much more diverse genetically today than it was even in 1918. It is possible that a modern Pandemic would result in uneven fatality rates in some geographic areas and populations in the U.S. on the basis of inherited resistance or susceptibility. If such differences do occur, they will be even more visible worldwide. f. Health care is much different today than in 1918. Today, compared to 1918, far more people live another day only because of modern medicine; “collateral” deaths may be much greater. I’m referring to the medically frail, from babies to the elderly who face a huge risk from any infection: immunocompromised from AIDS, cancer and or treatment, those with arthritis, asthma, lupus, etc who are on chronic steroids or other immunosuppressant drugs; dialysis, sickle cell, ventilator patients…the list goes on and on. These Americans are among the first to face the reality of a quick death from any interruption in the supply chain for reasons like intravenous or enteral nutrition, continuous home nursing, life saving medications, and need for prompt health care intervention to even mild fluctuations in their health status. None of these folks would have lived long enough to become so frail and dependent in 1918, so a pandemic today in 2006 in these people will push the death toll even higher. We have nearly 2 million people in nursing homes, and for many of them, their survival in a pandemic situation is doubtful. g. Our “just-in-time” supply chain will collapse in a pandemic. If every person in any community went to the store and bought even 1 day’s worth of food the shelves would be emptied. If large numbers of people have to go into quarantine or if the food supply chain is interrupted (and it will be) how will food be supplied to the people, where will it come from? The US government no longer has emergency food stores for its people. Where we previously had up to 3 years emergency food stored for each person, there is now less than 16 pounds and of that, 11 pounds are in the form of raw wheat.
3) The figures being used to formulate pandemic plans range from “best case” scenarios to average or median. According to a report in the Washington Post, certain members of Congress received a secret briefing about the bird flu on October 12, 2005. In that briefing the upper-limit figure of 40 million to 42.5 million dead in the U.S. was raised. (Source: “Capitol Hill Flu Briefing Was No Trick, and No Treat”, Washington Post, Thursday, October 13, 2005; Page A02. Quote: “O’Toole, a medical doctor and public health specialist, said the bird flu of concern is potentially worse than the 1918 pandemic that killed 675,000 Americans. And this time, she said, the mortality rate might not be 1 or 2 percent, but 40 or 50 percent. “You can do the arithmetic,” O’Toole said. For those keeping score, that’s 40 million to 42.5 million dead.”) http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9675585/site/newsweek/ I am not an alarmist but shouldn’t at least some degree of planning be based upon those greater numbers?
Please take time to read the following report by Michael T. Osterholm, PhD, MPH Dr. Osterholm is director of the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy (CIDRAP), associate director of the Department of Homeland Security’s National Center for Food Protection and Defense (NCFPD), and professor in the School of Public Health, University of Minnesota. He is also a member of the Institute of Medicine (IOM) of the National Academy of Sciences. In June 2005 Dr. Osterholm was appointed by Michael Leavitt, Secretary of the Department of Health and Human Services (HHS), to the newly established National Science Advisory Board on Biosecurity.
http://www.cmc-amman.gov.jo/Preparing%20for%20the%20Next%20Pandemic.doc
I would also suggest that you spend some time at a particular website which both the CDC and WHO recommend people go to for information on Avian Influenza. http://fluwikie.com/
I ask that you begin to address these questions publicly now rather than wait for a pandemic to begin. Making public such information now may cause some over reaction but that would not compare to the confusion caused by waiting until the event is upon us.
Questions concerning organizations like Mel Trotter Ministries: 1. Is it a “given” that in a pandemic quarantine situation organizations like Mel Trotter would be shut down? 2. What would be the “trigger” that would close our doors? 3. If we are forced to shut down, what plan and mechanism is in place to provide food and housing for our clients, the homeless? 4. Is there anything that can be done now to insure organizations such as Mel Trotter could stay open? 5. Could an Emergency Operations Plan be developed that would satisfy a criteria to allow us to stay open? 6. Are there any state agencies that could assist in the development of such a plan?
Questions from a concerned member of the public. 1. In your first committee meeting the focus was upon the poultry industry and their planning, the second meeting had its focus on the Public Health industry. What is being done in other sectors of society? What plan is there to insure that the basic needs of food and water will be met? What is planned to insure the continuation of basic services or utilities such as water, electricity, natural gas? Most public utilities have emergency contingency plans. Those plans are rather limited in their scope and duration, are they adequate to deal with supply and personnel disruptions that will exist in a pandemic situation? Most municipalities have only a few days supply of disinfectant for water treatment, if the supply chain is broken how will they supply safe potable water? 2. In the two previous meetings most if not all of the discussion involved bird-to-human transmission. The safeguards in place in our poultry industry would seem to minimize that threat. What is much more likely to occur is the virus mutating to a human-to-human variety outside the US and then entering on human carriers. With H5N1 being contagious many days before symptoms appear this pandemic may spread to all segments of the population before it is even noticed. What is in Michigan’s Pandemic plan to anticipate and deal with this possibility? 3. What will be the “trigger” in deciding to close schools, churches, and other places of public gathering? 4. In the most recent meeting the question was asked “what is the current level of preparedness” in our hospitals? One answer given concerned quantity of supplies, medications, masks, etc. and it was stated that they were being told to “prepare to be on your own for 72 hours”. Who told the hospitals 72 hours and where does the 72 hour figure come from? In reality won’t supply disruptions be more in the nature of days or weeks rather than hours? I recently went into a pharmacy in one of Grand Rapids hospitals looking to buy some N95 masks. There were two boxes on the shelf, I bought them both and it was over a week before they were finally replaced, and then with only three boxes. If the supply of something so basic is lacking now under normal conditions, what will occur to change that to the better in a sudden pandemic? 5. If we see large numbers of people being quarantined, and the “just-in-time” supply chain breaks down (and please explain how it could not break down), what plan and mechanism is there to get food & water, and medical treatment to the public quarantined in their homes? Where will these supplies come from? 6. What about mental health facilities i.e. inpatient psychiatric facilities; some may have court committed patients or patients downgraded from larger state facilities for sex offenders etc, Meghan’s’ law tracking, community based group homes, boarding homes. Most of these have large number of chronically ill mentally ill and/or dual diagnosis patients (i.e. mentally ill chemical abusers (MICA). What is in the State plan to provide for these facilities? 7. What about our jail and prison system? How will they handle their supply and personnel disruptions? Most are short staffed now, how will they deal with one third or more of their staff being absent from work? 8. What are the determining factors in deciding what businesses should close and which should stay open? Will this be a decision left to the business owners or will the state make that decision? 9. What would qualify a person for state “unemployment” income in the event that companies close down in the wake of a pandemic? Might be better for a company to go ahead and shut down as soon as a pandemic starts and let the employees apply for unemployment benefits early on while it is still possible to sign up? If a company tries to limp by for a while and closes later, the employees might be out of luck because the system would be too clogged to process new claims, are state employment officials making plans for such a situation?
I plan to attend next week’s joint committee meeting in Lansing; I look forward to having these questions answered in that meeting.
Debp…I think they are pretty busy at the health dept. here,as mid MI is having the largest outbreak of whopping cough that the state has seen in decades.I see it as a wakeup call to the area,and I see the local health dept reacting in a positive way,making plans for bf,planning to attend the meeting on the 14th in Lansing that eod has mentioned…I got the phone # for MT>P’s local emergency planning response team and they meet next week.As I have been in lots of contact with the health dept.lady she asked me to join in that meeting…If you are near MT>P lmk…I will give you the number to ask if you can come also…
thanks, i would love to go to it, but right now it is a little far for me- i don’t travel in winter.(bad arthritis). i did have an odd thing happen- i was trying to talk to someone at the local hospital about what they would do about the bf- and she actually asked me if there was a case in town. i said no-none in the us yet- but that reaction alone scares me a little.
We certainly have plenty of out of town/country visitor cause of that gambling joint here and I suspect it may bring us bf sooner than some places if sustained h2h were to occur.did she have answers for you as to what they would be doing to prepare for bf.
yes, i think our town will be hit hard (with a major chemical company headquaters here) i have friends coming and going out of the country weekly for work. i can’t get anywhere- tried the health department and then the hospital. i think the woman thought i was loony for even asking. she is supposed to call me back. i don’t hold out much hope. for a town this “well educated” sometimes i wonder.
Seems like maybe some of those scientist would be making a deal of it…I might think of trying the pr dept..at the headquarters if I were you…I am close enough myself,I may try that.Good Luck Deb.If you are new to the wiki pay close attention to the prepping info here it is very useful…
thanks, i have found this site really helpful. i just bought the huge bottles of laundry soap(buy one get two free at meijers) only to realize i had 2 in the basement- i guess i have laundry covered for a year. i have a whole list of little things to get- if only my budget holds out.
i talked to someone at the health dept. about what our town had planned. he was very friendly and it sounds as if they have some plans in place. he said they have 100 cots available to set up at a different location than the hospital. but.. a hundred cots for a town with 45k people? he said next month they are going to start doing some pr about the bird flu. one thing he did say was that he doesn’t believe it is h2h yet, and that you can get bf from eating the chicken. (i thought you couldn’t) but i was at least somewhat happy to know they are at least getting prepared for it.
So does anyone have any info on yesterdays meeting in Lansing? (the 14th). I couldnt get the Ag committe page to open.
Anyone in Michigan finding dead crows?
Well, I have heard of a few being spotted at a concert recently :)
Originally published March 7, 2006 Dead crows cause concern for the county Anthony Martinez Beven The Enquirer Several Battle Creek residents have raised concern over about 10 dead crows found in the parking lot of the Columbia Plaza Shopping Center on 20th Street in front of the Big Lots store Sunday evening. Mary Dressel of Battle Creek said she was driving on 20th Street with her husband when she noticed the crows.
“With the West Nile virus found in crows, we couldn’t help but wonder if these crows were sick, or if anyone checked into it,” Dressel said. Calhoun County epidemiologist Amy Latham doubted the crows died of West Nile. But she said once information was received about the crows, it was forwarded onto the environmental health division. Ted Havens, director of environmental health at the county health department, said the West Nile virus program coordinator was unable to collect the bird specimens before the parking lot maintenance staff at Columbia Plaza disposed of the birds Monday. Havens said the West Nile virus typically is transmitted by mosquitoes during the spring and summer months. He also said crows and blue jays have been infected by the virus more than other bird species. He said the environmental health division will keep an eye out for other cases like this. Kim Signs, a disease epidemiologist with the Michigaan Department of Community Health, said only one dead bird case was reported by the county health department last year. The specimen was not tested at state health department facilities, she said, so the results were unknown.
I also saw these birds, at first I thought maybe some kids shot them with a pellet gun because they were all laying next to a light pole but I’m sure if some one shot at them the rest would fly away.Besides there was no arm on the light pole for that many birds to be sitting on. The newspaper also reported there were 10 dead crows but there were 12, 11 were in the parking lot and one was across the street in the schools lawn. Just seems strange to me. Birds don’t just fall from the sky for no reason.
MSU with this great and all powerful new animal testing lab. and we can’t even get the dead animals to it. Too bad we didn’t inform the public in a timely manner.
I am here in the Saginaw area watching the birds for anything strange. We had West Nile confirmed in the population of crows in our neighborhood last summer. I found some information on the MI gov. web site for people to contact if you see a die off.
also might check the usda
I thought the DNR plan was worth the read. I don’t think we will get a whole lot of response if we find dead birds because of the lack of resources (money and people).
I had to take my poor cat to the vet today (no not BF, he’s a house cat). I asked if they had gotten any information on BF and he said no, just what he picked up on the WNEM story.
Waiting, watching and protecting in Michigan
I’m starting to see more and more links to the thought that Michigan will be among if not the first state to see the bird flu here in the USA. So few people I know have even heard of the bird flu. Imagine what they will think when they see their state on the nightly news as ground zero.
Any plan to require poultry to be kept indoors yet.
I have contacted our counties emergency director - see if he bothers to call me back. i dont think we have a plan.
I wrote to my state senator and asked her what the state was doing as far as informing the public. no response on that question, however she did say that the dept of community health, agriculture, and natural resources are cooperating to monitor any outbreak. and approved HB 5630 that requires Commiunity health to develop and maintain a Panflu plan. She lives about a half mile from me, (which I found out after I wrote.) So at least I know that I’m not the only one in the county that knows whats coming. She attended all three of the meetings held in state so far. And what’s up with Levett? why isnt michigan even included in the next group of 20 states to hear his speech? We may possible be the first state hit and I have only found one news story about it dated the 20th.
Dont have an answer for you Ive contacted the governor and senators regarding the lack of PPEs and forced conscription of HCW so far Im batting 0 did get a phone message from the governors office hes to call me back Tues - we shall see. May I sugest you give the governor a call and express your concerns regarding the states lack of planning for HCW and forced conscription after all a election is looming. Working together we might get a ressponse Id urge you to ask all your friends to do the same. My next step is going to be the news media - I wonder if they would like to do a story on forcing HCW to work without adaquate PPEs. We have a pretty fiesty TV reporter on channel 8 in GR
here’s what bothers me, If we, the little people are aware and concerned about this, why isn’t Michigans leaders? It just seems like it should have been them informing us, not the other way around.
I hate to say it- but maybe it’s a case of we can ignore anything the public doesn’t know about. You would think she would be stepping up, though, with that last report of Michigan being one of the first states to have bird flu. Although, I live in Midland and for at least 2 years they denied west nile, even though Saginaw,Bay City and every surrounding county had it. It was a case of “it’s not in my back yard”.
Here’s the thing, West Nile is NOT active in Michigan at this time. The season has not yet started. The West Nile season begins when the mosquitoes come out. These birds died of something. Our state is not yet testing for the Bird Flu!!!? The concern is for the people coming into contact with these dead birds. The red alert for the authorities is a group of dead birds. This is the MAJOR cause for concern. Groups of birds are known for dying of other diseases, but the fact that the State did not respond to a group death in this case is very worrisome. The farmers in the local area should be alerted and backyard poultry farmers should be on the lookout for, and should report, any dead birds in their flocks. Just because the migratory birds are not reported to have flown over Alaska and down into us yet is not a reason to be lax at this point in time. At the very least this situation should have been used as a practice. I am simply appalled.
Galileo-
I agree %100. The system failed. Even if they all died of something that happens all the time here, it should have been investigated. Public awareness needs to be given a massive boost. I live so close to the ohio border that the only local news I get is from Toledo, so this wiki was the only way I heard of this. I wish there were more from Michigan declared on this board so we could get a better feel for how mwny preppers we have and if we are talking to enough county Health cooridinators, and local officials about what is coming, and are they ready?
retired paramedic MI My concern is also for Mom-N-MO who posted on another site. She had a lengthy description of birds dying down in central MO. I looked on the map and her location seems to be just north of where an avian cholera outbreak occurred back in Jan 2006. I must find that thread and see if there is any more news.
One thought is this - there is a total hands off approach from the government. M.Levitt states and restates this in his dialog with federal, state and local officials. The message is clear and it is that each person is on their own. Do they believe that it makes no difference if the birds die? They probably expect it 100% and realize that the government will be faced with armed private citizens if any official tries to cull a backyard flock. I mean, you know the folks here, they are armed and ready to fight for their rights - the government would have a terrible time trying to enforce anything with an armed population who did not have all the facts. I wonder if the government is just waiting for the human outbreaks.
From what I have read, there isn’t much concern in ANY state regarding bird die-offs. As a private citizen, I am watching in my Saginaw area for any dead birds and will be inquiring of how to handle the situation from the TPTB. I don’t expect much help. Europe was a surprise to everyone when BF appeared, seemily all at once. It would not shock me to find it in my backyard any day.
A close friend of my daughters is a nurse in Saginaw and knows nada about BF. I would hate to see her forced to work to bring it home to her young daughters (who play with my gk’s). I feel soon this situation will not be able to be ingnored.
well, my state senator is aware of the birdflu, having sat on the health committee meetings last month. But I know from talking to her son that she is not a prepper. She sat and heard the testimony from local experts. I dont remember for sure, but it seems to me it was the county health director from Midland or maby grand rapids. But the point is, I read his testimony transcripts. The state should be terrified of what is about to decend upon it. I know from first hand experience that the health care system will be overwhelmed, and non functioning three days into this. We lack the surge capicity to handle just the people that think they are sick, let alone the truly sick and dying. Too many times I had to shop around for a hospital to take a patient to, because the one a block away was closed to er traffic. Sometimes three hospitals closed at the same time in wayne county. Now down where I live, only one hospital in the entire county. four ambulances, eight paramedics. I used to have ten to twelve runs in a 24 hour shift. How long do you think it will be before the system fails?
Any Fluwikie types from Michigan manage to get one of the 500 invitations to the meeting with HHS on the 25th?
Retired Paramedic,Spoke to local health dept Environmental Services lady today in Mt.Pleasant.3 from our office are going.I asked her if she could bring me as a guest as kinda a joke and she said no but that “we could have lunch on Wednesday” I will let you know what I find out.How did the Cabelas thing go the other night?
the first hour was very good. If you are a regular on the wikie, you would have just sat there nodding your head going “yeah, knew that. and that, and that.” It was over the heads of most of the 80 some odd folks that were there. the second hour was all about why and how chickens lay eggs. third hour was Backyard Bio-security. Don’t wear the same clothes into your different coops. don’t raise chickens and turkeys in the same bldg. that sort of thing. they never disscused what the state plans to do to keep us safe. He did say to call the DNR if you find more than three dead birds at one time, and that you could get on a plane in an infected country and be here in 14 hours. Had a nice slide show too. as a Paramedic, I thought it was a little too graphic for some of the young kids that attended, but then, I’m not a farmer. Perhaps farm kids see chicken innards all the time. lol He did try to stress the fact that “when this thing goes H2H, all bets are off”. Talked about the MSU Animal Bio-lab and that we can get exact results on dead birds in 24 hours. We have one of only 13 labs in the country. there are four more of these seminars yet to be held. the next one is in Bay county.
I did get an invitation to tomorrow’s summit. I contacted the state office for The Department of Community Health who directed me to the “person in charge”, a Rosemary Franklin. Rosemary extended me an invitation and directed me to a website set up to register for the summit. She also sent me a web address where they plan to have an archived web cast of the summit.
But not of course until AFTER the summit.
I’ll try to get a summary post out in a couple days after attending.
Here is a summary (of sorts) of what I picked up on at Michigan’s summit. The only order it is in is the order of presentation at the summit. I am leaving out the technical stuff on the virus itself, pandemics general info, etc. and will just post the items on preparedness. Sorry if this is unorganized but I don’t have much time to put this together - horribly busy week.
KEY FACTORS: Local Preparedness is the foundation – “Preparation = Thinking the unthinkable” Simultaneous outbreaks are a certainty in our culture today; Expect up to 40% absenteeism in the average business; Distribution of antivirals is critical – US goal is to build up to 81 million courses with 6m designated for containment of outbreaks & 75m to treat 25% of the population (the projected infection rate) CURRENT PROBLEMS – No current plan to distribute vaccine if/when developed, How to spend available funding, everyone has own ideas of what is critical – looking for Federal guidance on this issue, Vaccine producers have either gone to or are geared up & ready to go from 9 months per year production to 24/7 production HOMELAND SECURITY has identified 17 sectors & key assets: Under 6 categories (1) PRODUCTION INDUSTRIES – Energy, Chemical, Defense, (2) SERVICE INDUSTRIES – Banking & Finance, Transportation & Border Security, Postal & Shipping, (3) SUSTENANCE & HEALTH – Agriculture, Food, Water, Public Health, (4) FEDERAL & STATE – Government, Emergency Services, (5) IT & CYBER – Information Technology & Telecommunications, Internet Alert Dashboard, (6) OTHER – Commercial Facilities & Real estate, DHS daily report contact information, General HOMELAND SECURITY ROLE: (1) Secure borders and transportation systems; (2) Sustain the key assets & infrastructure, (3) Insure continuity of business, (4) Insure continuity of Government, (5) Overarching coordination role between Federal, State, and Local MI STATE POLICE – Clear command & control with predefined conditions & benchmarks triggering protocols (it aounded like they would be the main “arm” of enforcement for Homeland Security?) CHALLENGES TO PANDEMIC RESPONSE: (1) NO EMAC assistance – Emergency Management Assistance Compact = Through EMAC, a disaster impacted state can request and receive assistance from other member states quickly and efficiently (2) Reduction in volunteers, (3), (4) Sorry, missed those two SPECIFIC QUESTIONS TO THE PANNEL: (1) Social Distancing & School Closings – If needed on a State Level = Department of Comm. Health, on a Local Level = School Superintendent and/or Local Health Officer – Key public education piece will be general encouragement of staff & students to stay home for all sickness (2) Business Preparedness – Develop a general education module for employees now, develop a pandemic action plan (or use existing plans – see Gov websites) that includes predefined conditions & benchmarks triggering protocols, identifies key/critical operations & personnel, infection control plan that isolates employees & allows employees to work from home, advance stocking of critical supplies, level of coordination with local Health Department needed (3) Family & Individual Preparedness – Public education; risks & avoidance, advice on hygiene, seasonal flu vaccination; involve community & faith based organizations, plans need to be multi-dimensional (work, home, & school); practical solutions – basic plans, time needed to prepare, resources needed & available, stocking basic supplies. Major problems in MI hospitals that will have impact in a pandemic – Surge capacity; currently 26,000 beds in MI hospitals (1918 Flu pandemic MI had 100,000 infected), Access to supplies, Triage of the infected (including survivability evaluations), Isolation of the infected, Personnel shortages HEALTH DEPARTMENT ROLE – (1) Preparedness Plan – part of the states All Hazards Plan (stated that the plan has been tested twice already this year), (2) Each local HD has completed an assessment of their plan & is working to correct identified flaws, (3) Front line surveillance plan working with Hospitals, Physicians, and Pharmacies, (4) Timely containment – movement & travel restrictions, quarantine, (5) Public education – before, during, and after – key to public education = honesty of a frightening topic.
Thanks EOD for the summary. So glad Michigan had a summit.
Did anyone address any specfics on the security of municipal water supplies? Also, will they be forcing health care workers to work the duration?
The top 5 things Homeland Seurity gave as their priority was (1) Water (2) Food (3)Energy (4) Banking & Finance (5) Chemical Industry - plus border security was right up there too. He did not explain the items on the list, he just listed them.
I got the impression that health care workers is of particular concern especially for the eastern half of the state & especially the Detroit area, they mentioned that 25% of the hospital staffs were from Canada, but no mention was made of forced labor of any sort. A shortage of health cafre workers was mentioned several times through the summit but no solution was spoke of.
It would seem that the State police will play the key role in manageing whatever the flu brings us. Captain Kriste Etue is the Commander of the Emergency Management and homeland security Division of the Michigan State Police. I live in a small village with contract police coverage provided by the county sheriff. Who will the locals call when the cops are both out sick. Who will put out the barn fires when the 25 fire fighters are too sick to respond. Why am I the only one in Michigan that thinks in a worst case scerario frame of mind. I asked one of my old partners that still works as a paramedic if she had heard abything at a meeting or just around the ambulance barn if the ambulance company was planning anything for the bird flu, she said not a word. They don’t think it is going to be a big deal. This is Huron valley Ambulance in Ann Arbor. They own/operate South Lyon ambulance, Jackson County Ambulance, lenewee County ambulance, and provide 911 response to Monroe county. And they don’t think it’s a big deal. We are truly on our own folks.
Thanks EOD for going and reporting back here.Was there anything said about the backyard poultry/small flocks in MI. or poultry in the upcoming county fairs?
Retired Paramedic….I’m with you :)but a friend of mine who is a fire fighter says he hasn’t heard a thing but assumes his company will do what they need to do.My hubby works for State Mental health,nothing said there.My mom in State FIA , nothing mentioned. I hope the recent meetings will spark some more action.
One thing that bothers me is the recent surge of layoffs of police and firefighters in several towns. We are going to need everyone of them when this hits. Also, are they still going with the plan to close schools when a student gets sick? I had heard there was something going back and forth about the health dept. deciding when to close them.
It sounded like the local health departments will be given much authority in things connected to containment; quarantines, closing schools & businesses, outlawing public gatherings of just about any sort. They did mention the first person making the decision at schools would be the superintendent but I imagine that would only be in the opening days of a pandemic and quickly shift to the local health officer.
Some mention was made about backyard flocks, mostly about an education program now and actual monitoring once the virus arrives in the US.
I too am concerned about the police & fire dept. I find it interesting that as this looms closer and closer with the virus expected to arrive on our shores this fall that right now we are beginning to hear of increased troop withdrawal from Iraq. That and other things make me wonder if the government is more concerned than they are letting on. Would make sense to build up slowing on public education to avoid panics. If that is the case, lets just hope & pray their timing is right on.
Yesterday at my church we had “Preparedness Sunday”I was so happy and proud that 108 people who attended the service were told by their trusted pastor that they had better prepare.I provided the fellowship meal with easy store foods and spent several hours answering questions about food storage and preservation.we collected 450.00 for our food pantry.I guess I am now outed as a prepper for sure but the thought that these people I love and their children I love alot more are now possibly going to be prepared makes it worth it.
How did this come about, who instigated and who did the planning? I have spoken “in passing” to selected folks from our church but all I have gotten is a confused look and some comments about flu season is past for this year.
In late December I contacted my pastor to ask him if he was aware of the pandemic influenza threat.He was and we spent quite a bit of time discussing it.Over the next few months I continued to email links and my thoughts about what was going on.In March I asked him if he planned to have a sermon on preparedness anytime soon and he then said he would after Easter.His sermon was basically Being prepared physically,mentally and spiritually.His angle was more the “any emergency” but did name bird flu and pandemic influenza.He read scripture from Matthew 24 3–14 and spoke of the parable of the ten virgins and joesphs dream interpretation.He said “These things cannot be denied”(emergencies a’comin)and matthew 24–25 Being prepared is being a good Steward.I planned and provided the fellowship(for we Methodists “chow time”)which we do every week after church for an hour or so to munch and chat.I had a printout of water sanitation instructions,oral rehydration solution recipe,simple flu care instructions.He didn’t go into any things about social distancing or hand washing.Included in the program was a sheet titled “Physical preparedness Guide list” which our church secretary made up from several guides and checklists I had linked to her from fluwiki and more.It started out with the ski jump analagy(plan and prepare ahead,when you flying down the hill too late)Then had a sample food list,list of otc meds and reminder to stock perscription meds,another list with soaps and household needs,Advice to talk to loved ones of how they would like to be cared for with yet another list of stuff like lamps,oil matches,campstove,etc.Then had website to cdc,red cross,fema, Next she added…Be Aware that if an emergency occurs,emergency rooms may be filled,grocery stores may run out of food,gas may be scarce and utilities may fail. I think I just lucked out to have a pastor who is open to dealing proactively with this situation.
Also want to add that some people just didn’t really have much to say about it,others were full of questions but only 1 who openly said he was not worried at all.Oddly he has the most to worry about as he runs a pheasant hunting outfit.He raises the birds and his kids help him out.His 11 year old daughter only 2 weeks ago told me about how they spin them in a bag then let them fly out while the hunters shoot em down.I could see that the mom was worried after the service so I hope she goes home and looks on fluwiki which was the web site I had on my “Dont get caught with your pantries down sign”
Where is everyone from Michigan? Has anyone heard what your county is doing to prepare? I have sent several e-mails in Calhoun County but have not recieved any response. No surprise there!
Bird flu preparations intensify
May 19, 2006 - 8:28AM (NEWS 3) - There have been no reported cases of bird flu in the U.S., but state leaders have stepped up surveillance. They want to know within hours if the deadly bird flu lands in Michigan.
State health, wildlife, and farm experts have prepared plans on how to react to the avian flu. Two-thousand wild birds will be sampled for the flu this year. That’s on top of nearly constant monitoring of commercial chicken and turkey flocks, as well as hospitals.
The state’s Bio Safety Lab for Animal Testing is also on alert. They’ve been preparing for the bird flu for two years.
With new equipment and additional staff brought in to handle testing, the center’s director calls it the largest effort in the last 10 years. The center, located on the Michigan State University campus, will analyze the thousands of tests planned statewide.
“We can identify the bird flu, avian influenza virus, H5N1 in about three hours or less. That is vitally important because every minute counts,” said center director Dr. Willie Reed.
Reed says lab workers will be available 24 hours a day, seven days a week for testing if needed.
So far, there have been no cases of bird flu in North America.
http://www.wwmt.com/engine.pl?station=wwmt&id=26554&template=breakout_local.html
I’m here in Michigan. Reading away almost non stop this week. I am intent on getting the latest on the situation in Indonesia. These developements are making me do some serious shopping tomorrow.
I hope I am just being nervious and the only way I hear of a local case of BF is in a bird or two
I’m afraid there are very few of us prepping in MI
Prepping in Mid Mi. but sometimes feel I am the only one.Went to a local emergency planning meeting last week and tho they are thinking about things I feel it isn’t enough.I wish there would be more focus on personal preparedness rather than reasurance messages.I posted in the units of action threads about a phone message put on the www.cmhd.org (health dept.)phonelines.They have updated their website a bit to include links to pandemicflu.gov site.I think it seems like tptb in my town are thinking about things but not speaking out.
oops….www.cmdhd.org
Well I have a call into my countys health dept [thats where I was directed] that was over a month ago - not even a return call. I dont see any local action at all. The State is not doing anything to protect health and save lives. Their focus seems on staving off “panic” calming fears so we all still buy chicken.
I wont even go into the conversation with Grandholms office.
Im now anti politics - send em all to China on a slow boat!
What about alerting each other on deals in stores - Big lots has camping lights from $1.99 to $9.99
Funny, yesterday on the news they talked about Saginaw county having a “diaster preparedness drill”. The person being interviewed didn’t say a thing about bird flu, finally at the end, the interviewer kind of smirked and said for the bird flu, she agreed. After that piece they had a one minute segment on the Michigan summit. I feel so prepared now.
Central Mi health dept had a surprise drill about a week ago.State(I think)called them up and they had to go to their vax site after making several calls to their counterparts thru phone,cell,and radio contact.Also they came up with alot better distrubution of vax and antiviral plan,The old one was stuff people into lines at the football stadium.New one is park in center lane with drive up access.Thing is they seem to stop on the medical and emergency part.The preparedness and information part is really lacking.I haven’t asked them yet but the way they talk about the antivirals it seems maybe they have some stocked..I hope they aren’t counting on some promise of “Their share”
Its sad to see that there are only a dozen of us from Michigan. I found this site with a listing of all the county health departments if anyone is interested in contacting their local to find out what they are doing for the community to plan and prepare. http://www.malph.org/page.cfm/108/
DebP I saw the Saginaw piece on the news. IMO, I think everyone in the Saginaw area is WAY behind the curve. Maybe they are all focused on the Delphi/GM headache. There might not be anyone left here by the time it gets rolling.
I did some prep shopping today. I didn’t see any shortages but everything is up in price. Could be the reaction to fuel prices. I suggest if you see a good sale on anything you need to get it bought if at all possible.
One thing I really want and haven’t got yet is a pitcher pump for our old crock well. We have city water now but it seems like that would be nice to have as backup.
I have been prepping for the last few months. You are right, everything has gone up in price. I won’t have any money for preps the next month or two, because I am buying a older car(the owners are letting me make payments). I guess you could say it is part of my preps, because I haven’t owned a car for the last two years. I was seriously thinking about never having one again because of the cost. But I was finding it was too hard to prep, because I couldn’t go to the stores when the sales were on.
Saginaw is going to be in some serious trouble when/if this hits. They are laying off so many of their police and fireman. I have noticed some of their crime is beginning to spill into our city. I feel very bad for all the troubles they are having now.
I should add my county isn’t much more prepared. They can spend millions on a new ice arena, high school football field and new jail- but only ordered 100 cots. It makes you wonder about people sometimes.
“Its sad to see that there are only a dozen of us from Michigan.”
Lutosh, you can count me as one more from Michigan in the southern area.
The writing is on the wall… the government has warned the public and the masses respond by purchasing wide screen TVs and video games for their kids. If this goes H2H we will have a real mess on our hands. Everyone will be crashing their SUVs into the front door of Sams Club.
I don’t think the authorities have any concept what could happen or how to prepare. My kin folk are fat dumb and happy and my wife thinks that BF will go away if I just stop thinking about it.
I pulled up a migration map some time ago and noticed that MI is a main conduit for migrating birds from Canada.
Spent the day in TC yesterday at my nieces graduation party.It was very nice to get my mind off bf for the day but also alarming as my family just doesnt get it.Even my auntie who just retired last year as an ICU head nurse was pretty much ignorant about the subject.”you’re worried about getting a flu from birds?”I tried to explain a bit but couldn’t see taking over the day with it.
Talked to a nurse with Visiting Nurses today. They are the agency that handles the yearly flu vaccine clinics. They will be doing the H5N1 vaccines too [the ones that dont exist]. Their agency is not contracted to do anything else to her knowledge. Its is still a mystery who is going to be staffing the surge sites?
The nurse I spoke with said that HCW will recive the vaccine first when it becomes available. She has been in contact with the state. She has no idea how they are going to distribute the vaccine with virtualy no staff. Seems lots of plans are being made with no thought on where the manpower to do all these things is coming from - the Nurse fairy apparently
I was flipping tv channels, and on our public access channel there was a half hour show on the bird flu. I am glad they are talking about it, but I do wish they would get their facts straight. The doctor on it said NO human to human infections. They are only testing birds, which when found dead are not to be picked up by the health dept. The pandemic won’t occur until 3 months after the start of it- where did they get that info from? They did order an extra 100 cots- making the grand total 200. The health dept is deciding where to hand out tamiflu (for all 40k of the people, where does all that come from?) The reason they ordered the extra hundred cots is for an undisclosed location(refused to tell me where when I spoke to him a couple of months ago), because there will be so many people too sick to stay home, but not bad enough to be hospitalized, and I quote “those people that need care for two, three or four days”. I guess they are planning on the condensed version of the bird flu to arrive here. They are sending home a brochure with all school kids, I can’t wait to see what is in it.
It’s a little late to register, but Oakland County is doing a program to prepare businesses for pandemic flu on Thursday, 5/25/06. Here’s the link:
I’ve been writing to the county to find out what their plan was and here is the only response I received so far.
Dear Ms. Wagner, My name is Amy Latham and I am the Emergency Preparedness Coordinator and Epidemiologist for the Calhoun County Public Health Department (CCPHD). Thank you for your email. I hope to summarize the activities taking place in our agency surrounding the possibility of avian and/or pandemic influenza in this email, but feel free to contact me if you have further questions.
The Michigan Departments of Agriculture and Natural Resources are the lead agencies for avian influenza planning in Michigan (see: http://www.michigan.gov/avianinfluenza). We take our direction from these departments for avian flu-related issues such as reporting bird die-offs. I have attached our fact sheet on avian influenza and the State of Michigan’s brochure which contain more information.
Our primary concern with avian influenza is that it may change to a form that is highly infectious for humans and can spread easily from person to person, thus becoming a pandemic influenza strain. CCPHD takes a lead role in pandemic influenza planning in Calhoun County and collaborates with response partners on a regular and frequent basis. This collaboration includes exercising various components of the community’s response plan. I have attached a summary of CCPHD’s responsibilities related to pandemic influenza preparedness and response here. We maintain a Crisis and Risk Communications Plan that addresses how we will communicate with the public and with partners (such as physicians).
We do not have any public meetings scheduled as of today. However, the Health Officer (Dottie-Kay Bowersox), Environmental Health staff, and myself have been giving talks on the topic to various groups. Our overall approach is to work through stakeholder groups (such as schools, day cares, businesses, etc.) to provide preparedness information. If a case of avian influenza is identified in the U.S. or if the virus changes to a form that is highly infectious for humans and spread easily from person to person, then we will begin communicating with the public more aggressively.
A good source for additional information is http://www.pandemicflu.gov.
If you would like to talk about this issue in more detail, please contact me.
Sincerely, Amy Latham
DebP…..Due to our close proximity,I wonder if our health dept. are working in tandem….Here in MT.P they also ordered 100 cots,and seem to be focused on the vaccine and antiviral distrubution sites….Do any states actually have their antivirals in hand?They talk as if they have it already.I hope we aren’t all in for a big cya when tshtf.I pray the focus will change to individual preparedness soon because it doesn’t seem to be a priority now…….
After many calls to my school district super,telling him we need to plan and get ready to keep our kids up to date with schooling it hit me like a ton of bricks….Hey I am a sunday school teacher and I needed to do the same for my students.Got packets with sunday school materials around for 15 families from my church and community.I am also going to print out Wills guide to place in each packet.Can I get some ideas from anyone tho?Should I give these out now to be held by the families or wait till it seems like my last week at church?
the state bought 36,000 doses of tamiflu about six months ago. Per the states response plan, it is stored in a secret location and is to be distributed to designated vacination centers via armed escort by the MSP under the direction of Captain Kriste Etue, Commander of the Emergency management and Homeland security Division.
…”if the virus changes to a form that is highly infectious for humans and spread easily from person to person, then we will begin communicating with the public more aggressively.”
…When learning curves and adjustment reactions, and the supply chains will be such that- they will have run out of time…
Carry on! (maybe those folks will only *need* care for two or three or four days alright…what’s their mass casuality management plan?)
as near as I can tell from a quick check of the Michigan pandemic plan, The Mass casualty management plan is……
“Up to local authorities”.
Sleep tight, you’re on your own.
Hmmmm….Maybe a quick trip to Meijer is in order….
;)
First time poster, long time lurker.
The Oprah show has got at least one more person prepping in our state. I work as a cashier at Meijer and have only had one person admit to prepping for BF and that was right after Oprah todday (and I cash out about 600 grocery orders a week). The lady was concerned for her grandchildren and was working on a 2 month stock (she still needed a lot, if her order was any indication, but she’s started). I refered her to this site, I hope she comes and takes a quick (or preferably long) look. Personally, I’m at 6 months and working toward 9.
Just had to share that one ray of hope, and I’m back to lurking.
Dragonlady….welcome aboard :) Is Meijer making any plans? Does your Meijer keep hand wipes for the carts available?In MtP they must think of me as the wipes dragonlady.Good job being so stocked up,My family of 6 keeps it pretty hard to keep stuff in the house,but I did get a huge batch(20 cases) of someones Y2K 15 year #10 cans off ebay and I have alot of home canning.My kids will definately be jonesing for all the good stuff they scam out of our preps.
My husband took the last weekend to travel to MN to visit step-daughter and family. We took the northern route over and the UP is so beautiful and isolated. I almost wanted to stay to avoid any exposure to BF.
My step-daughter hasn’t prepped at all and was glad to hear that I has a stocked pantry so they will move in (with 3 growing boys). Guess I need to stock some more.
Posted in thread titled…Causing influencers to promote provisioning………Reported reply from State level epidemiologist…As retired Paramedic says…Sleep tight ,Your on your own………
I am fully aware of the DNR and the state guidelines on reporting dead birds, however…. a situation has arisen that is outside the protocalls. I do landscapeing. I mow alot of lawns, and I’m seeing three to five dead robins every day. so is my partner. so that’s almost ten dead birds a day, all over the county. Not sure of the significance, but found it odd enough to report.
Hello Michigan prepers. I have been doing the p thing for a long time. I have got thur to some people but took some time. The thing that scares me I WORK FOR THE SCHOOLS AND NOT A WORD YET.
Malachi - none of the local Meijer stores has the handwipes. Mine did when it first opened in 2000, but it was never used according to the greeter supervisor and eliminated.
A word on the stocking situation, I noticed this week that we were a little low in a lot of the departments, so I started asking those department heads who were in the breakroom while I was on lunch. Meijer gets at least 1 truck in every day except holidays (including Memorial day). We are currently behind 1 delivery. Every truck that has come in since has more merchandise on it, but we are still low on a number of things in many different departments. So don’t expect a full stocked store for a week or so after a holiday.
Also, Meijer, like Wallyworld, does inventory by computer. A list of whatever is sold in the previous 24 hours is sent by computer every afternoon to the local warehouse to be sent to us on the next day’s truck. The stockers don’t always get the trailers completely empty as soon as it comes in, so if the shelf is bare, ask. Most of the guys know what has been stocked and what is still sitting in the trailer (yes, there is normally a trailer at least half full of stock sitting on the loading dock). The overnight stockers empty the trailer, but the trailer at our store gets there about 10 am and is picked through by the day staff to fill holes on the shelves or customer requests. The only exceptions are seasonal stuff, like Christmas trees, fans or bar-b-ques.
As far as bird flu, I’m the only one in my store with a clue. I’m a lowly cashier and am supposed to direct any and all queries to my direct supervisor and he said “don’t worry, it only affects birds.” As soon as TSHTF I’m quitting and SIPing with my parents at their Amish built farmhouse (we’ve added electricity and water to half of it already, the Amish lived with a powerless Artesian well, and so could we).
Retired ParamedicMI−20:03 (I mow alot of lawns, and I’m seeing three to five dead robins every day. so is my partner. so that’s almost ten dead birds a day, all over the county. Not sure of the significance, but found it odd enough to report). I have also been finding dead birds, so far three in my yard and in speaking with my neighbor discovered he has found over a dozen in his yard. I have reported the birds I have found and also wrote to them about my neighbor. I have not found dead robins but two were black birds and one was grey but it was not a dove or a pigeon. It is possible we could have a bad case of WNV this year. Here is a map of reports-so far none in Michigan. http://westnilemaps.usgs.gov/us_bird.html
That was my hope, since the mosquitoes are very bad now. But I haven’t seen any reported as yet myself.
If you ever see them in Midland county, they are supposed to be reported to misquito(forgive my spelling)department. Apperantly they are also testing for bird flu, when it gets here.
What’s the buzz on bug bites, stings? Experts offer tips on what to do By Kim Mitchell Staff Writer
The dry climate going back into 2005 may not have been the best for farmers, but the lack of rain has made a difference in mosquito bites.
“We’re having a very mild year so far,” said Cy Lesser, mosquito control specialist for the state Department of Agriculture. “We’re about as good at predicting mosquitoes as meteorologists are the weather. We can only give a forecast four to five days out. It all depends on the weather.”
All the Eastern Shore needs is a big rainfall or a tropical storm and mosquitoes will start swarming.
“Nothing eminently is going to occur, but at some point, we’ll have a large number to deal with,” Lesser said.
Until then, he said mosquitoes are in their typical locations and are more abundant near large wetlands and marshy areas, such as is found in south Dorchester County and western Somerset County.
The weather, however, doesn’t affect the Asian tiger mosquito that lurks in urban back yards.
“This foreign species throws all the rules out,” Lesser said. “It doesn’t need marshy areas. It doesn’t need roadside ditches.”
Just a small amount of water, a quarter of an inch, is enough for the Asian tiger mosquito to breed.
Lesser has found dozens of larvae in bottle caps.
Any amount of standing water is an invitation for a mosquito breeding ground, Lesser said.
“It’s the No. 1 mosquito problem in developed areas,” he said. “Everyone has them in their yards. They never leave.”
Because these biting nuisances are in everyone’s back yards, they’re also difficult to control.
With only a small amount of water needed, Lesser suggests eliminating their methods for breeding.
“Get involved,” he said. “Get rid of their habitats.”
Birdbaths, kid’s toys, lawn furniture, saucers of flower pots: If there is standing water, there can be mosquitoes, he said.
This breed of mosquito is aggressive and feeds mainly during the day.
Mosquitoes are sophisticated, Lesser said. Most people don’t feel it when its feeding, only the itching sensation after the bite.
Mosquitoes are attracted to carbon dioxide.
“Mosquitoes are able to detect a stream and follow it several yards until it finds its source,” he said.
Flies with a bite There’s something obvious about no-see-ums.
They’re tiny, but there’s no mistaking that they’re flying about.
“They’re extremely small, but they have a painful bite,” Lesser said. “It’s like a hot pin prick. You know when no-see-ums bite.”
People often have a worse reaction to the fly’s protein, which is injected into the skin during feeding.
These annoying little pests breed in the mud and muck of intertidal areas. The greater difference between high and low tide gives more habitat for the larvae.
These flies are weak, though. With winds blowing more than five miles an hour, it can limit no-see-ums’ activity. They thrive in low wind, high humidity with higher temperatures.
Green-headed flies are aggressive and annoying. Their bites exceed the “hot pin pricks” of no-see-ums, Lesser said.
The flies live in mostly marshy areas, but are so large that they can fly in winds that others can’t and travel greater distances.
These flies hunt visually with their large eyes.
Their season’s just starting, but Lesser said that homeowners kept from doing yard work by the flies can do something about it.
There are green-headed box traps that collect the flies in large numbers.
“They’re very effective in controlling local populations and can make a big difference,” Lesser said.
With a sting Most people try to avoid them, but where there are flowers, there are bees.
They make nests in back yards, even on homes and in walls.
And they land people in the emergency room every day, said Dr. Bill Todd, medical director for the emergency department at Peninsula Regional Medical Center.
While one or two people head to the emergency department a day, Todd said the majority are suffering from an allergic reaction.
Many show up without complications, just pain, and localized swelling and itching. But a small subset of people, about 5 percent, are allergic to the venom and can suffer severe reactions that in some cases lead to the intensive care unit, Todd said.
Swelling is normal for the average person, said Dean Burroughs, a certified master beekeeper.
Burroughs said there are lots of misconceptions about bees, and the problems they bring have simple solutions.
Only a small fraction of stings lead to death, he said, and most people overreact when stung. Most people also overreact when they encounter a stinging insect.
“They will not bother people unless people bother them,” Todd said.
If a sting occurs, Burroughs said to treat the sting with ice, alcohol and baking soda to lessen the venom’s effects. An old-time remedy includes combining water and tobacco, then applying it on the sting.
If a stinger is in the skin, gently scrape until it is removed. Most stinging insects do not leave stingers.
Most stinging insects will not swarm, Todd said, but when yellow jackets and hornets sting, they emit a pheromone that attracts others. Burroughs said the insects will not follow humans very far.
For those who are allergic to bee stings, Todd said to avoid interaction at all times and carry an EpiPen to inject if stung.
Because stinging insects like to build their nests in a variety of locations, avoiding them is difficult. For people allergic to a stinging insect, Todd suggests avoiding all types because their venom is very similar; removing a nest is a necessary precaution.
For nest removal, Burroughs suggests spraying a chemical directly on the nest at night, when the insects are least active, and for the most part, in the nest. Remove the nest the next morning.
Because hornets hatch every day or so, Burroughs suggests disposing of a hornet nest in a plastic bag to ensure none will return.
Burroughs advises people to get rid of nests only if they are a nuisance.
“They’re not going to attack you,” he said. “If you can leave them, do so for pollination. One-third of all the food we eat needs to be pollinated. We need them.”
Ticktock They’re in back yards, at the park, in the woods. Ticks are pretty much everywhere.
The smaller the tick, the more problems they may bring, said Dr. James Burns of the Main Street Medical Center.
The two smaller breeds of ticks can carry Lyme disease and Rocky Mountain spotted fever.
“The dog ticks can get to be the size of a marble,” Burns said. “But they won’t hurt you.”
It’s better to deal with prevention than the aftermath of tick bites, he said. Repellents work, he said, and it may be a good idea to spray areas, including back yards.
Humans aren’t the only victims of ticks, so Burns also suggests protecting the furry members of the family.
After visiting an exposed area, Burns said checking for attached ticks is a necessity. Belt lines tend to be a common area for ticks as well as in the torso and back.
“Just take a look,” he said.
Tick victims head to the doctor for one of two reasons, Burns said. They manipulated the tick but couldn’t remove the head or are worried about the spread of disease.
In Burns’ experience, the best way to get rid of a tick is not medical. He said to light a match, blow it out and place the hot end on the body of the tick. It will open its mouth, spread its legs and give the person enough time to get it off the skin.
Tweezers are also a good way to remove a tick, but Burns warns that the area needs to be inspected to make sure the tick is completely removed. He said removing a tick is more difficult when it is dead.
Many people seek treatment and testing for disease immediately after a bite.
“There’ll be a reaction from the bite, but it’s not necessarily an illness,” he said.
Burns said it takes a few weeks before testing for Lyme disease is effective, but people often forget about Rocky Mountain spotted fever.
If a rash develops with flu-like symptoms and a headache a week to 10 days after a tick bite, the person is likely to have the fever.
The Eastern Shore is an endemic area for Lyme disease.
“It’s known to be in this area with a high frequency,” Burns said.
Dealing with summer bugs Areas that combine low wind, high humidity and high temperatures favors on the side of insect activity, Lesser said.
He advises people to avoid stinging and biting insects if possible, but if not, there are certain precautions that may be taken.
Wearing proper clothing — including light-colored long pants and sleeves, hats and socks and shoes will make a difference. Lesser recommends treating exposed skin with an Environmental Protection Agency-regulated repellent.
“There are a lot that haven’t gone through registration,” he said. “If they’re not fully tested, it’s probably not wise to use.”
The most effective products are those that contain deet. Newer formulas that use less deet, at 30 percent, are more than adequate, Lesser said.
For those who don’t like the oily feel and odor of repellents can opt for other products that are fairly effective in preventing bites.
Repel uses oil of eucalyptus that has a light, fresh odor and is not greasy. Picaridin is another option that doesn’t smell or have other deet side effects.
For long-term effectiveness, Lesser suggests using deet products. With other options, he said they last up to two hours, but may need reapplication due to perspiration.
Reach Kim Mitchell at 410–845–4634 or kmitchell@salisbury.gannett.com.
Originally published June 5, 2006
Has anyone seen the emergency preparedness booklets made by the state of MI dept of community health.Distrubuted thru county health depts?They let me pick up a box of 500 to pass out in my community.It started out by saying how in MI we know about preparing for blizzards and such,but we also needed to prepare for biological and bioterrorism threats.Then it had a page with info on anthrax,botulism,small pox,gasses,dirty bomb,pandemic influenza.Panflu page starts with description-A new flu virus that spreads among people across the world.In the past influenza pandemics have led to high levels of illness,death,social disruption and economic loss..Goes on to describe symptoms…Last section…Immediate action/treatment…avoid sick people,stay home from work or school if sick,cover nose and mouth with tissue to sneeze or cough and throw it out,wash hands,These last 2 kinda had me wondering what they were thinking….Seek medical care early,Now this last one is directly quoted from the booklet”Antiviral drugs are available for people at high risk of complications”After this they have a section called creating a family emergency plan..Says to keep some essentials but gives no amounts or time frame that would be needed.Tells people to learn more and learn terms such as isolation,quarentine,sip,and evacuation.Tells people to talk to employers,schools and daycares about their plan.Tells them to watch the news during emergencys.Next section titled Health and emergency info is something I hadnt seen before.It give people some info on what to do if mass immunizations were to happen.Says listen to news to find out who should go where and when.If you are directed to go you will need to bring important medical info with you also for each family member,picture ID,medical records age and weight of kids…..Last pages are medical record pages for 7 people…
I passed out 50 of them to parents of kids who came to our vacation bible school in my community,But I pointed out to each that the statement about antivirals was false or at least in my opinion overly optimistic.
Just curious if any want to share? Are we all scattered over the state or are some of us closer to each other? I live just outside of Grand Rapids, a town called Jenison, what about everyone else?
Mt.Pleasant address but I claim the small community of Rosebush…My dad lives in GR and I have spent quite a bit of time there.Great town..or should I say Grand.
bumping for bill
Malachi, those pamplets were supposed to be given to every student in our school system(never happened though). I am in Midland.
I am in Livonia. Our city web pages currently have no information regarding AI, so I sent the following letter on June 14th. Didn’t receive a reply and sent a follow up on the 21st, which was acknowledged later that same day. Here is my letter and the reply.
Mr. Peter Kunst, et al., I am interested in obtaining information in regards to Livonia’s preparation for a possible Avian Influenza pandemic. I was just browsing the city web pages and could find nothing on the subject. I have been following news reports with some regularity and have found that most government officials have indicated that planning and safety is up to the individual states and municipalities. Basically, it’s a “You’re on your own” message from what I am gathering.
I have visited the pandemicflu.gov web pages, as well as the Department of Community Health pages for the State of Michigan. I have found much useful information on these pages regarding state, business, and individual family preparedness; however, I was surprised to find nothing on the City of Livonia web site. It is my understanding that individual cities have been encouraged to implement plans to help assist their own residents. Livonia has such a large populace, including many elderly who probably cannot prepare. I hate to imagine what could happen to our local citizens should this pandemic occur and blindside us. I am sure this is of concern to you, as well. Perhaps I am looking in the wrong area. Would you kindly direct me to any information available for Livonia resident specifically.
Reply came with an attachment showing an outline of the page they are going to put up after approved by committee.
Thank you for your email and for taking the time to inquire as to the City’s preparation and planning in regards to a possible Avian Influenza pandemic. Currently there is no information posted on the City of Livonia’s website regarding Avian Influenza, whether in regards to prevention or planning. In order to address some of the very issues that have been detailed within your email, the city has already established a Pandemic Planning Team. This team has been tasked with recommending preparedness initiatives for city government, as well as preparing and disseminating information out to our residents on the Avian Influenza and the possible pandemic that may follow.
The team has already begun the process, meeting its first priority, by preparing an informational page that can be accessed on the City of Livonia’s website. This web page would provide general information on the Avian Influenza to our residents in hopes that educated residents will promote better preparedness on the home front for our community. Additional objectives of this team include the continuity of government services and Public Safety Operations during a pandemic.
The informational web page should be on line shortly as it is being reviewed and formatted for the City of Livonia’s website. I have included, in an attachment, information that will be available to our residents very shortly. We will continue to update facts relative to the Avian Influenza and preparedness, as additional information becomes available.
Once again thank you for your email and hope that this provides you with some insight on the city’s preparedness initiatives. If you have any further questions please fell free to contact me at anytime.
Sincerely,
Shadd
Shadd A. Whitehead, Fire Chief
Livonia Fire & Rescue
14910 Farmington Rd
Livonia, MI 48154
Office# (734) 466–2430
Fax# (734) 466–2188
Email: swhitehead@lfdmail.com
Why is the format on the Michigan pages so wide? I have to side scroll to read all the pages, but not the others.
FYI A 3 county region in SE Michigan is planning a pandemic tabletop exercise in July, as well as a more extensive exercise in August. Oakland county has published a pandemic brochure which is pretty well done.
Epid, do you have a link for that brochure? I thought L. Brooks Patterson was dissing everything about BF… oh, and the sidescroll is from someone putting in a long URL — please use the tinyurl service on the bottom of each page, or the moderators have to come and fix it. Northstar
SSA,
Sorry, I could not find an electronic copy of the brochure.
You can probably call and get one.
There is information at www.oakgov.com.
http://www.oakgov.com/health/initiatives/emergency_prepardness/pandemic_index.html has pandemic preparedness info.
BTW, the Oakland County Pandemic Business Symposium featured posters with L Brooks Patterson
sneezing into a hanky. I believe he was there, also. It seems he is taking it seriously now. They are planning a second business symposium for July.
DebP….Hmmm…I had sent an email to my health dept. practically begging them to put those out to students well in advance of school being out.She just didnt reply for over a week and after school was out.I wonder why they didnt follow thru with giving them out?I didnt go and get any til yesterday.Also what does everyone have to say about MI declaration that antivirals are avaialable for those at high risk?
Epid in MI……Is this true that MI has antivirals for those at high risk?I know we bought 36,000 courses so do we in MI feel that only 10% of our population are at high risk or do we have plenty for everyone?
Could anyone posting links PLEASE use the directions listed below…Our thread is now almost impossible to read..
malachi
I have no idea how much Michigan has stockpiled. I don’t think any state can afford enough to treat everyone who gets sick, much less enough to prophylax everyone for (?)months.
IMO stockpiles are most likely going to be used for prophylaxis of HCWs, Police, Fire, Key personnel (water? electric?)etc. and maybe treatment of some cases.
Malachi 00:08 Great news about the booklets. I live near Saginaw and I will be visiting the Sag. County health dept. today or Monday to see if I can get some to pass out. Especially to my kids who live in Fenton and Linden.
I have been following the story out of Canada concerning the dead goose and the missing information with great interest. We are just a neighborhood away. I have begun to worry about the real safety of our poultry supply.
I was also encouraged to read on another thread that Livingston County is recruiting additional nurses in preparation. Part of my family live in that county.
Keep prepping all you fellow MI folks.
Over the weekend I put those booklets into 6–8 rest areas from mid MI to the bridge…..Hope they get picked up and put to use….
bump
bump
bump
bump for BB.
Interesting article about tainted frozen fowl from China in SE MI. http://tinyurl.com/oxyma
yikes…..
All I can say to the Troy raid is..that’s just great. We have to worry about the fall migration and now this too. Big YIKES>
All I can say to the Troy raid is..that’s just great. We have to worry about the fall migration and now this too. Big YIKES>
bump
is it just me…..
Why did the Feds destroy the chicken without testing it first?
Maybe because some had already been sold and shipped out, Michigan doesn’t want to be the first state with h5n1…. I think the list could go on and on.
Don’t you just love this state?!
Wasnt the state. From what Ive read the Feds destroyed the chickens [evidience]. So much for Chinese food.
From what I understood,the state was pissed that the evidence was destroyed before it could be checked.I do love this state so I give it the benefit of the doubt and lay it on the feds.After all ,being on our own as we have been told why didnt they pass it over for us to test at MSU. I fear it is more of a North America thing,Look to Canada’s dealing of the situation on Prince Edward Island.I must admit I being a north American do not want this crap here as much as anyone but I do want the TRUTH……….
Malachi I want the truth too. But I have come to the conclusion that were not going to get it. The best we can hope for is boards like this that pick up some tidbits and give us a heads up before its to late. Im now a confirmed cynic
bump
One small piece of good news, I think.
My Meijer just got in new wipe dispensers for the entrances and they went up yesterday. I haven’t seen anyone using them [but me :(], but I haven’t acted as a greeter since they went up. I’ll keep an eye on them and let y’all know.
krogers has had them for a while in my town. I don’t even give them a second thought. My first thought was…… “When did Howard Hughes move here”?
If you are so paranoid that you feel the need to wipe the handle of the shopping cart befor you touch it, Then my advice to you is to stop eating fast food. at least dont get ice in your drink.
Retired ParamedicMI — I’m no germophobe, but as the parent of a toddler, I can tell you there seems to be a direct correlation between putting a little kid in a shopping cart and them coming down sick! I don’t usually bother for myself, but when I bring my little one I always wipe the handle down with the alcohol cleanser. Hey, I’ve seen people hacking into their hands and then just pushing the cart along! Eeeeew!
Yes, I’ve often wondered how many pissy diapers have sat in that seat, as I put my bread there to keep it from getting curshed.
Keep prepping Michigan….Bump
Well, since it got bumped… Aug 22 Metro Detroit hospitals are doing a dry run for bird flu… people feigning bird flu symptoms are going to show up at participating hospitals’ ERs to check the response. Sorry, no cite; just something I saw in the paper. And there has been yet again another big-business meeting about bird-flu planning recently — it was in the same little article about the hospital trial — quite a contrast to how downplayed the whole bird-flu thing has been to the public in MI. Our big “summit” received almost no press. We didn’t even get Levitt.
Retired Paramedic — That’s why the little seat flips up! LOL! I can guarantee you, pee diapers and worse! I guess it’s the oldsters hacking against the youngsters excreting in the germ battleground in the shopping cart wars… ;-D
Good deals at Meijer on laundry soap this week….buy one get two on the huge liquid Gain 200 oz bottle…
Hope you are doing great Michigan preppers….(DebP especially)
Thanks, I am hanging on, just going day by day.
Glad to hear it Deb………Btw…Meijer didn’t have their wipes out at either greeting stand last night…I gave them heck about it.
The Monroe county health dept. is having their annual flu vaccination on oct 25. But this year they have a new twist. they are incorporating a pandemic mass vaccination exercise along with it. the normal price for the flu shot is $23.00, it will be ten if you sign up to play along with the exercise.
Thats good news about the exercise.I hope they get lots and lots of people participating so it can be an idea of a dose of things to come for them.I believe that 10 is the standard price for vaccinations IF a person does not have insurance,at least here in Isabella county.My kids were a bit behind last spring and when I caught them up that was the price,10 per shot on all vacs including pnuemovax.
Glad some counties are doing something. Bravo for Monroe co.
Meijers had TP on sale last week too. I picked up a few rolls. My dh has a thing about all the TP we have so I had to restrain myself. Hes fine about all the other preps just the TP seems to bother him. Must be a man thing.
LOL…Janetn…If he is anything like my hubby he wont want it stacked around but sure would cry when he had to use newspaper….He’ll be glad you bought it :)
“You know that you have enough TP when you can use it for insulation or barter” quote from michigan dad
Has anyone seen a TV ad from the Michigan State Government that was all about being “prepared for anything”? It showed a family in their home with the lights going out and the chaos that follows … looking for the flashlights….and so on..
Very basic and thought provoking. It had a web site name that had the word “prepared” or “preparedness” in it but I can’t remember it and can’t find it on the mich.gov site.
I think someone is getting the ball rolling.
Bridge Lifter — Don’t know why I am even checking this thread as I do not live in Michigan — but THAT TV AD WAS MY IDEA!!! (-: It was in one of my very first posts ever — about March I think — in a thread about “Large Scale Prep Encouragement”. I said people are motivated more by fear of embarrassment than by fear of something unknown….so show the lights going out during dinner and the chaos that ensue.
OK, it could have been someone else’s idea too. It’s a fine idea! (-:
I dont know if it is okay for me to ask this here but I will and if the mods think it is wrong they can delete.Does anyone have any canning jars they can donate to me?I am making my new job cleaning out peoples gardens and fruit trees.I just drive around and see a bunch of tomatoes left to rot or a fruit tree still full and ask them to let me have it.I only have a few more days for tomatoes.I dont know how I will distrubute this food when it is needed butI know we will have extra and do hope I can figure that out when it is needed.If you still have tomatoes or jars or any produce that will rot away,Please let me know I am willing to drive 2 hours to pick them up and will not let it go to waste.
Malachi-at09:23 If you live close to Ohio, Indiana and Illinois have you thought about posting your request there? Blessings on you and your efforts.
malachi,
Are you a UPer?
Central MI….Middle of the mitten
Shame.
Oh well.
I did break down and buy more cans today so that 2 gardens I know of wont go to waste,So glad I did because when I was at wally world (like the second time I have gone in but I wanted the cheap “golden harvest cans”)A young lady started asking me questions about canning jelly.I told her a few things and suggested she buy the blue book,we got to chatting and she is prepping,When I told her I was also,she said maybe I would want her extra grapes,apples and pears!!!!I need those blessing to have the strength to keep this canning frenzy pace up so thanks Michigan Mom :)Did 6 mayonnaise jars of regular pears(before the wally world trip)18 pints of curried pears which are like a pear pickleish deal,12 quarts of pear sauce and 18 pints of RED Wine flu killer pears.Also keeping the dehydrator running and I gotta say they are my favorite thing I have dried so far.Just 8 more bushels to go on this load..So I am still looking for cans.
Why Nawtybits?Do you have cans or produce?I am going up north on saturday to see my new nephew by mackinaw…Are we getting warm yet?My dad is coming thru the UP in a few days from Canada….
Malachi-My hubby has bought many jars from Goodwill and Salvation Army for less that $2 a dozen. I too am canning my brains out here in the thumb,it got so bad that I left the pressure canner on to long and the presure got really high-scared me half to death! I took a couple of days off so I could get some rest. Still blessing you
MI Mom…I do keep checking those sources and come acrossed a few here and there.I got signed up for freecycle a few days back and posted there also.keeping on keeping on with all this produce.I did take it pretty easy today as compared to the last few days. :)
Malachi
My parents live in Clare county (just north of you) and they have peaches that my mom cannot keep up with (canning and jamming). She said you are welcome to them. Email me at dragonlady313 at hotmail.com and I will give you the address or their phone number.
Diane
Cool thanks Dragonlady :)…Will Email right now…Malachi doing the happy dance!!!!!!!
HI Malachi, My husband seems to be fasinated with fruit trees so everywhere we have lived he planted them. We used to live next door to our current residence, he planted friut trees there also. The nieghbors moved out so he raided the pear tree yesterday, came home with 8 grocery bags of pears. I immediatly thought of you, then I thought you lazy old woman take a page out of Malichi’s book and can them yourself, we will also distribute them where needed. Thanks for the inspiration!
Great MI Mom!!!!!!I just planted 2 apples and 2 pears in my yard this summer,To go along with the old old apples I have now.My cousin surprised me this morning with an old dehydrator.I remember my aunt drying cherries in it when I was 8 or 9.It is handmade but big.12 trays big.Also has the tempurature settings.Beats the ronco I have been using.That will help with the jars issue although I got a few at goodwill/salvation army over the weekend.SA had a box of 18 for 5 bucks but 4 of them were blue glass with the original lids from ball.Those I cant use to can as they have rough tops but my mom was really happy that I gave them to her for her collection.(and to store dry stuff)Good luck with the pears.PS…..I really doubt you are lazy!!!!!Pears are not the easiest to can with all that peeling.
EOD…Thanks for the link to the juice steamer the other day.I don’t forsee being able to get one for some time.My mom told me that my grandma used to do it this way….Wash grapes,add 1–2 cups to 1/2 gallon jars,add some amount of sugar and fill jars with boiling water.Hot bath some amount of time.Let them set for at least 2 weeks before use.I have done it this way in the past with good results.It did come out more like a concentrate but Oh the flavor!!!Nothing grape flavored is like real grape flavor.Of course I can’t find any recipe like this.They all call for mashing and straining.At this point with all the canning and drying and juicing I am doing I think I will trust grannys way as it is so much easier.I had a person comment that all the time I was spending wouldn’t it be easier to just get dole canned fruit.At this point I can’t even get a jug of milk but I can scrounge fruit and veggies for free.A great way to stock food for my family and many others if it comes to that.I just hope they love pears and tomatoes.
Malachi - Please check your e-mail.
Malachi - I used to can mine that same way, don’t remember the exact receipe but I do remember 2 cups grapes per quart. I’d say start with 1/3 cup sugar per quart & fill with water; unless your grapes are REAL sweet that should not be too much sugar and you can allways add a bit more when you go to drink it if needed.
Meijer has all their store brand items on sale this week Canned foods for .19! That should help a lot with prepping!
I am canning pumpkins and wondered if anyone has any reciepes for pumpkin other than pie or bread and cookies? Pumpkin is loaded with all kinds of stuff that is good for you-just don’t tell the kids. thanks
My kids love pumpkin butter…My sister makes it and for the longest time my kids would pass it up for a different flavor.Then we were out of others so they tried it.Now it is their favorite.I am taking off to church in a few but will get the recipe from her when I return.I am taking a week off from grapes till apples.I decided to wait on those since they will keep for a while yet.Got 17 1/2 gallons of grape juice 15 jelly and one batch of wine.
Malachi thanks in advance we will give pumpkin butter a try! I’ve done all the apples I care to do this yearand pears too!!!!!!!!!! Lots and lots :) We have canned hundreds of jars of stuff, but from what you have said we are nowhere near you and yours. The salvation army in Flint had alot of canning jars Sat. they were running $2.05 per dozen, don’t know if this is in your area but it is a good price. My hubby who retired from Delphi Oct. 1 (another pair of willing hands) picked up some 2qt. brand new with the lids and rings-itmade me think of you. Anyway if you are close it might be worth a call to see if they are still in stock, Don’t forget to talk to the manager you might get a better price, we get the old peoples discount. Blessings on all your hard work, Mi Mom
Well I wish I would have done more of the grape jelly,The kids are putting quite a dent in that already.My sister has not called me back yet with her good pumpkin butter recipe but I’m sure I will talk to her tomorrow as it is our tradition to call each other on Mondays after our kids are on the bus.Flint is a bit of a drive for me,I am in Mt.P.but I continue to get a few here and there at my S.A. and goodwill.Plus I hit a church sale and got 40 pints for 10 cents apiece.When I start in with apples I plan to get them pressed into cider for freezing and would start canning that as soon as we were in a sip situation.Then I will do some apple marmalade and a bit of pie filling.I have already done 40 quarts of sauce so I am finished with that also(thank goodness ,my foley food mill is small and I was sick of cranking that thing)My mom and I are thinking of going in on a new preasure canner so I am feeling giddy about that ! I got a new (used) shelf to store my canned goods and it is so pretty all lined up there.It will kill me to cover it but gotta keep the light off so I guess I will just have to peek at it alot.I think of you and your hubby whom I think of as MI Dad appleseed and wonder why anyone would ever plant any tree but a fruit tree.Blessings on you 2………….
Malachi you can still turn that grape juice into jelly! It might be a fun thing for sip. DadMI allpeseed-he will get a kick out of that.
Malachi you can still turn that grape juice into jelly! It might be a fun thing for sip? MI Dad appleseed-he will get a kick out of that.
Sorry for the delay MI Mom….Saw on another thread how you had finished canning,trying to prepare for a craft show this weekend,so I can have some prep cash and just slip out of wikie mode for a few days.I did an inventory of my canned goods and thought I would share since I admit I am pretty proud of myself ;)
78 quarts of tomatoes
65 pints of salsa
12 pints of hot corn salsa
118 quarts pears
24 pints red wine pears
12 pints curried pears
8 pints pear butter
12 pints pear sauce
6 quarts pear sauce
24 quarts peaches
6 pints peach jam
16 1/2 gallons grape juice
10 pints grape jelly
8 pints orange marmalade
45 quarts applesauce (still will do apple pie filling,apple marmalade,cider)
10 quarts asparagus
6 pints green beans
60 pints assorted meats and fish
30 pints assorted bean soups and chili
Here is the pumpkin butter recipe….makes 6–1/2 pint jars
31/2 cups pumpkin ( solid pack from store or home canned,I prefer the storebought cause once I almost cut my finger off trying to peel pumpkin,maybe MI Mom could give us all some tips on making that chore easier)
1 1/2 teaspoon cinnamon
1/2 teaspoon nutmeg
1/4 teaspoon ginger
4 cups white sugar
1 1/2 cups brown sugar
1/2 tablespoon unsalted butter
1 3oz. pouch liquid pectin
in suace pan(without heat) combine pumpkin,cinnamon,nutmeg and ginger,stir well.
stir in both sugars,add butter…..
Start the heat on low and increase to med. stirring constanly till sugar is dissolved
Icrease heat to med-high then to high to bring mixture to a rolling boil,stirring constantly….
add pectin and bring back to rolling boil for 1 more minute stirring constantly
Remove from heat ,skim foam and pack into hot sterilized jars
process in hot bath for 15 min…..
Take care all and continue to prep,as so many aren’t.Together we can make a difference.
Just thought I would post to say hey to the other MI preppers. I’m one myself. Not fully preped but getting close. Currently preped with lots of knowledge, alot of which I have gained from the great folks here on the WIKI! My food stocks should be rounded out by the end of November.
Pumpkin peeling tip: roast the pumpkin first. I slice the pumkin into “boats” and roast until tender. This also carmelizes out the natural sugars. Sounds good already doesn’t it? Then just spoon the pulp off the peel, no problem. Pumpkin pies from scratch are unbelievable; the best pie pumpkin IMO is the Buckskin if you can get one. (Light orangy tan, looks like Cinderella’s coach.) That they are just used as porch decorations is just about tragic to someone like me!
Thanks northstar…..Great tip to save against the bloodbath I had that one time.Scared my young kids to death that day.We are considering doing a pumpkin wine and I am hesitant to do it cause the pumpkin has to be peeled raw.I am hoping my idea of doing it in very small chunks will work.Do you think that is the best way to peel it raw?
Opps that was me and so I guess you will all know it was me who got the free juice!!!!!!!!
Malachi
Have you tried using a potato peeler? I havent, but I know it works on cucumbers and that skin is almost as thick as a pumpkins.
No but I am gonna try that,anything to keep both sharp knife and pumpkin out of my hands ;)And welcome aboard!!!Do you mind saying what part of MI you are from?Letting us know if there is any activity in that area towards prepping?I am in Central MI and there doesn’t seem to be much action here besides everyone refering to the health dept will tell them what to do.Health dept is planning the wheres of vaccine distrubution and antiviral they don’t have.Beyond that I guess they are thinking hope is a plan.
hailing from metro detroit some decent planning going on in oakland county. and some not so decent planning going on in wayne county. Over all though the planning is a far cry from what it needs to be. I have contacted many local city govt’s and gotten the standard “were going to do what ever the county/sate/feds tell us to do”. I find it amazing that the locals refer to the state or federal plans and the federal and state plans say that it’s up to the local gov’ts to make their own plan. sad…. so onward we push to prep and educate the masses as to what may be in store for us.
I agree totally about locals refering to state and fed when it has been pretty clear from them that locals must have their own plan.Sad and scarey.Good luck to you ChuckE,prep on and push on.
Oh, for God’s sake NO don’t peel a lot of little peices! The first time we did a pumpkin from scratch my husband misunderstood my directions and chunked the punkin and we took *hours* peeling the little chunks. I was so mad! What I would do is take a big sharp knife and just make long vertical peels, like taking the outside off a pineapple. Does this make sense?
I almost have it ;)northstar.Would you peel the”boats”cut out raw or leave it whole and peel?like one would with the pineapple.
Malachi Thanks for the pumpkin butter recipe I will try it out real soon- saved some pumpkin for it (anything in a1/2 pt. jar is’nt really canning to me, it’s just plain fun). Steam the pumpkin for 20–30 min. and the skin will come off easily!
Sorry I didn’t finish what I was saying, Gut the pumpkin if it is small I just steam it whole if it is large I will cut it in 1/2. I guess it would depend on the size of your steamer. I have the large steamer juicer from Lemans and it works great for steamimg also for apple sauce and grape juice as well. Because of the way it collects juice I have to add some back in when making apple sauce. Another fab feature is that it also distills water.
Malachi, I would leave it whole to peel — it would be more stable to handle. I’ve seen Martha doing the vertical peel thing to a whole grapefruit, if that makes a better visual image.
Malachi- Goodness girl you sure have been busy by my calculator you have canned 550! What a blessing you are! I spent the day canning pears with a friend I even threatened to send the rest to you if she gets any more pears, but I see by your count you really don’t need them. Mi Dad wants to do a count also (I just have to remember where they all are). I imagine you are also running out of places to stash canned goods. We packed the china away so we could use the cabinet for storage. Some of my wonderful friends have offered to take them home and store them for me- sounds fishy. Anyway you have done well and I’m sure carma is stacking up in your favor, blessings to you and yours,ann
Malachi- Goodness girl you sure have been busy by my calculator you have canned 550! What a blessing you are! I spent the day canning pears with a friend I even threatened to send the rest to you if she gets any more pears, but I see by your count you really don’t need them. Mi Dad wants to do a count also (I just have to remember where they all are). I imagine you are also running out of places to stash canned goods. We packed the china away so we could use the cabinet for storage. Some of my wonderful friends have offered to take them home and store them for me- sounds fishy. Anyway you have done well and I’m sure carma is stacking up in your favor, blessings to you and yours,ann
No!!!!I can’t look at another pear for quite a while,Even tho I finished canning pears over a week ago I just finished drying pears a few days ago.I’m peared out!I have a built in china cabinet that has a very big cabinet below it and I have canned goods in there,In my kitchen I have these very high cupboards that I also have packed full,Then there is my new stand full and piled on top of it also.Space is definately becoming an issue.I placed an add on freecycle for a dehumidifier,I hope I get one cause we are steamy around here from all this canning.Ann is my twin sisters name and my daughters middle name.Have a wonderful day..Mary :)
I live in the middle of the thumb of mi. I own my own Foster Care Home and also work for a Health Care agency. I teach and assist any other homes who are willing to listen to me about emergency preparedness. Right now I wish I could get everybodys attention at the same time. The fact that we should take any flu seriously,also snow storms or power failure should be second nature to any one with the responsibility of others lives.I feel that the government owes the people the best and the most up to the minute information it can give us. After all, if we are old enough to vote we should be old enough to use good positive information.I am ready how about you?
Maid in Michigan- Welcome aboard finally!
The TPTB may owe us the most up to the minute information but you will find the information on this web site long before you hear it from TPTB.
In the US states plan thread monotreme pointed out that MI has the worst plan of all states and JanetN suggested we go to Lansing and shake things up a little before the elections.Is anyone else up for this?I live one hour from Lansing and would be willing to go.
All depends on when Malachi, would be nice to meet everyone anyways :)
Hey Maid - I’m originally from a little place called Deckerville.
Well I am in for anytime.2 hours notice is what I need.JanetN and others please weight in.
I live in SE Michigan, close to the Ohio border. I just read Monotreme’s assessment of the MI plan, so am really busy trying to read all the info on our state’s planning. God help us in a pandemic, because it looks like the state won’t be very useful.
Looks like we are 50th in emergence planning as well as econimic growth.
I can’t take a trip to Lansing because of work but I am up for sending some emails. But election or no election I really don’t expect much help from anybody. Maybe Walmart? Seems like the goverment and et al have left the social responsibility of actually planing for community diasters to Wally world.
Malachi How about next Thurs. Nov 9th. or the following Thurs. this is after the election and we wont have to compete with all the election coverage. We need a slow news cycle to get any coverage. At first I thought before the election would be good but I thought better of it, for the above reason. Im available the 9th, 10th, 15th, 16th and 17th Thursdays seem to be slow for news. Or do we want to plan for after Thanksgiving?
EOD I believe were in the same neck of the woods, Im north of GR 50 miles. Want to share a ride?
Once we set a time we need to start contacting reporters.
deborah where does mono have that posted?
janetn I’ll know better once a date is set. This is the busiest time of year for me at work, now through about the middle of December, so I really don’t know if the date you folks select will work for me. And every day is full & busy, so just set what date works best for everyone else and I will try to make it work. But otherwise yes, sharing rides would be great.
I’m not saying it’s a bad idea it’s just one I’ll have to think about. I am leaning heavily toward local planning.
EOD
My review of the Michigan plan can be found at US State Plans 2 at 22:00. This was followed by some discussion.
JanetN…I am pretty open most days…Except the 9th….I can be in Lansing by 9:30 am.
Michigan Mom I agree that the local officials have to plan and plan well. Without leadership from the state were going to have a mess. Even school closings would be a local decision, which would leave the communities with good planning next to a community with poor planning suffering for the nieghboring counties lack of foresight. The state cannot do it all but their has to be a cohesive plan that the local governments can look to. Some areas dont have any plan, they are waiting to see what the state does. some things cannot be done on a local level. They just dont have the resources. Its important to save lives, and lessen the economic hardship that the state be on the ball. Had the state put out a mediocore plan i wouldnt be advocating going to Lansing. We have a way to go to even meet the level of an acceptable plan. Somebody [ies] just plain didnt do the job they were tasked to do. They took the easy road slapped something together and called it good. That is just unacceptable.
Malachi the 9th is off the list. Lets wait and see who else might want to join us and what days work for thm before we set a date OK with you? BTW looking forward to meeting you. We need to have our ducks in a row before we go. We need to have our facts straight, specific problems with this plan and proposed solutions. We need to get quotes from Webster , Olsterholm , and Navvaro. as to the ramifcations of a pandemic and the seriousness of the H5N1 virus. BTW does anyone know where we can get Olsterholms testimony in front of congress?
My DH will go with us I might be able to scare up a couple of more people. If each of us brings a few friends or family we might get a fairly good sized group.
EOD I remember you had some contacts in Lansing, any chance they would meet with us to discuss the problems with the state plan? Would the middle of Dec work for you?
JanteN…Okay,I am going to start with getting a file of quotes from the heavy hitters,I think that will be a good start for me, Maybe we need to get a list going about exactly what we want to present and such.I think I should be able to get some family and friends together to come also.btw,I also look forward to meeting you and any others who will be coming.:)
malachiw_o@yahoo dot com
Has anyone else noticed an uptick in the media coverage of PF in MI? I’m in the north of Detroit ‘burbs and after months and months of me feeling like the lone loon in the wilderness preachin’ on bird flu over the sound of crickets from the mass media, suddenly I can’t open a newspaper without a BF story. Even my local little tabloid Advisor had a long article about how my little township is planning for continuity of services during pandemic flu! Smack me with a rubber chicken!
Macomb County has just come out with its pandemic flu response plan — I haven’t read it through but what I have has been interesting… it’s 90 pgs if you want to look at it.
If you haven’t read the post on Critical infrastructure preparedness response and recovery, download the PDF file and read it. At least read from page 30 or so. Try not to think of this as a call to action for bussiness, try to think of it as if it applied to your town city or village. Sweet dreams.
bump
Retired Paramedic: I’m unsure what you are referring to — a thread here or? Thanks.
Northstar -
yes, it’s a post on the wiki with a link to a document released quietly by the gov, dated sept 06. it is an urgent plea to busnisses in what is considered by the gov to be critical infrastructure to start planning for massive, excuse me, let me use the gov own words, “Catastrophic” losses. if you read through it with the thought in mind of, this is what your city or town or in my case village should be doing to prepare, you may get very scared. I’m sure the gov is being kind in it’s estimate, and yet it is terrifying to read.
janetn – at 22:59 At this time I am afraid I just won’t be able to spare time untill after the 1st of the year. But, I can make a few calls over the next few weeks and see where that goes.
EOD Thanks the calls would be great. do you think you could get any of your contacts to meet with us??????
Thats what I will try to persuade them to do.